Nikon RAW vs TIFF in DSS

[modelsbynight]

Hi
I have Nikon Z7ii And when I use DSS to stack images I do get an error about LibRaw not supporting Z7ii raw files
also when I do a star count in DSS it shows 440 stars in the TIF file and the RAW only about 60 or so
The score for the files is like 3000 on the TIFs and 500 on the RAW files.

DSS is suppose to understand my Nikon RAW files but this test shows that it actually has issues with them

Next test will be with DNG files as the TIF files are like 300mb vs 80mb RAW so take up space.

Before using DSS I used the Sequator program and it seemed to work better. But I think I like DSS better now.

Unfortunately I don't have any new raw files to use and still using my Nov 2022 files, weather is either 2 cold or cloudy to get new stacks

[JSBach1801]

Have a look at the free software Siril. It can stack images too and has a lot of nice built in features working with your stacked file afterwards.

I don't know if it supports Nikon RAW, but it's good software to have and know about regardless.

[seigell]

RAW Files - whether Nikon NEF or Canon CR2 or CR3 or any other Brand - have unique minor format differences per DSLR Model. These differences must be "explored" and "reverse-engineered" because the Camera Manufacturers rarely provide the details for free. For programs like DSS and Siril and even PixInsight, the code to manage that Raw Decoding is libRAW - which a non-profit group works to maintain and releases a few updates to their libRAW.dll every year. The Z7ii has been out for a few years, so it is surely covered by a modern libRAW version. DSS incorporates whatever is the "current" full release version of libRAW whenever a new version of DSS is released.

What version of DSS are you running?? v3.3.4 (ancient)?? v4.2.5 (old)?? v5.1.x (current)??
Make sure that you are running a current version before stating that DSS doesn't handle your Camera.

[SkyHiker]

Have a look at the free software Siril. It can stack images too and has a lot of nice built in features working with your stacked file afterwards.

I don't know if it supports Nikon RAW, but it's good software to have and know about regardless.

Have you actually used Siril? I tried and found the interface is too atrocious to even try. I am still interested though but I need some hand holding to figure it out, if you have any leads, please let me know.

[modelsbynight]

Have you actually used Siril? I tried and found the interface is too atrocious to even try. I am still interested though but I need some hand holding to figure it out, if you have any leads, please let me know.

I actually tried it with my old data last night

You need to basically create 4 folders in your Windows PC Pictures folder

Folders needed

Biases
Flats
Darks
Lights

And add your images into each folder. And then run the script "OSC_Preprocessing" from the Script menu

This is part of the script file as it runs (shown in console view in the Siril program)
3:11:26: ############################################
13:11:26: #
13:11:26: # Script for Siril 1.2
13:11:26: # February 2023
13:11:26: # (C) Cyril Richard
13:11:26: # Preprocessing v1.3
13:11:26: #
13:11:26: ########### PREPROCESSING SCRIPT ###########
13:11:26: #
13:11:26: # Script for color camera preprocessing
13:11:26: #
13:11:26: # Needs 4 sets of RAW images in the working
13:11:26: # directory, within 4 directories:
13:11:26: # biases/
13:11:26: # flats/
13:11:26: # darks/
13:11:26: # lights/
13:11:26: # Saves masters to ./masters/
13:11:26: #
13:11:26: ############################################
13:11:26: Running command: requires

It then does everything automatically

However there is more to it then just this. This the very simple steps needed.

To do anything more advanced then this I have not yet learned how to do much more

Also it creates a FIT file which needs to be saved as a TIF , unless you have a program that can open FIT files.
If I recall you use the SAVE button at the top to save in TIF or other formats

[modelsbynight]

What version of DSS are you running?? v3.3.4 (ancient)?? v4.2.5 (old)?? v5.1.x (current)??
Make sure that you are running a current version before stating that DSS doesn't handle your Camera.

I am using 5.1.3 DSS


This the error I get when doing a star count, it still works and gives a count however compared to the count on TIF vs NEF there is a huge difference in the number

The Latest LibRAW does support my camera NEF files. It might just be that the count, which really is not needed , is not supported for NEF files for the Z7ii.

[SkyHiker]

Have you actually used Siril? I tried and found the interface is too atrocious to even try. I am still interested though but I need some hand holding to figure it out, if you have any leads, please let me know.

I actually tried it with my old data last night

......

To do anything more advanced then this I have not yet learned how to do much more

Also it creates a FIT file which needs to be saved as a TIF , unless you have a program that can open FIT files.
If I recall you use the SAVE button at the top to save in TIF or other formats

Ok well if that's all experience you have with Siril then maybe hold off with recommending it to others especially if the question was about DSS.

Thanks for the explanation though, but it does not encourage me to use Siril.

[SkyHiker]

Hi
I have Nikon Z7ii And when I use DSS to stack images I do get an error about LibRaw not supporting Z7ii raw files
also when I do a star count in DSS it shows 440 stars in the TIF file and the RAW only about 60 or so
The score for the files is like 3000 on the TIFs and 500 on the RAW files.

DSS is suppose to understand my Nikon RAW files but this test shows that it actually has issues with them

Next test will be with DNG files as the TIF files are like 300mb vs 80mb RAW so take up space.

Before using DSS I used the Sequator program and it seemed to work better. But I think I like DSS better now.

Unfortunately I don't have any new raw files to use and still using my Nov 2022 files, weather is either 2 cold or cloudy to get new stacks

There is a very good DSS IO group at https://groups.io/g/DeepSkyStacker . They have more expertise than we do, and certainly can give you an answer in short order.

[seigell]

@modelsbynight

I suggest that you make a quick post on the Official DeepSkyStacker Support Forum ( https://groups.io/g/DeepSkyStacker ).

You are running the absolute latest version - DSS 5.1.3

However, on a couple of past versions, the Devs had found they needed to code a couple of "Camera Alias" entries for Models which seemed to have different Internal Model Names depending on what part of the World the Camera was acquired. This may be one of these cases... If so, they can make another entry, and the fix will be in for the next point-release.

[seigell]

... also when I do a star count in DSS it shows 440 stars in the TIF file and the RAW only about 60 or so
The score for the files is like 3000 on the TIFs and 500 on the RAW files. ...

This is rather easy to explain:
Your TIF files are debayered - and probably Stretched / Gamma'd by default in whatever routine is converting the RAW NEF to TIF.
These actions will change the Brightness of the Image and the Shape/Size/Quality of the Stars.
While it may be a shortterm workaround for the mis-identification of your NEF files, it results in lesser quality Calibration.

As you hinted in the OP, look to Conversion from NEF to DNG (which IS universally supported in DSS), so that you keep your data RAW through the Calibration processes.

[Razz]

Have you actually used Siril? I tried and found the interface is too atrocious to even try. I am still interested though but I need some hand holding to figure it out, if you have any leads, please let me know.

I actually tried it with my old data last night

......

To do anything more advanced then this I have not yet learned how to do much more

Also it creates a FIT file which needs to be saved as a TIF , unless you have a program that can open FIT files.
If I recall you use the SAVE button at the top to save in TIF or other formats

Ok well if that's all experience you have with Siril then maybe hold off with recommending it to others especially if the question was about DSS.

Thanks for the explanation though, but it does not encourage me to use Siril.

Not that it's very important but he's not the one that recommended it. He just said that he had tried it.

[JSBach1801]

Ok well if that's all experience you have with Siril then maybe hold off with recommending it to others especially if the question was about DSS.

And to follow up, I never recommend Siril as a preferential program to another one. The OP was having issues with certain raw files being recognized in one particular free stacking software package. I suggested another free stacking package that MIGHT have support for the file types in question. However, I stated very clearly that I did not know if it would work.

So, maybe you could hold off with recommending courses of conduct to other people until after you read their posts, understand them, and have the sequence of "who posted what" clearly determined.

[modelsbynight]

@modelsbynight

I suggest that you make a quick post on the Official DeepSkyStacker Support Forum ( https://groups.io/g/DeepSkyStacker ).

You are running the absolute latest version - DSS 5.1.3

However, on a couple of past versions, the Devs had found they needed to code a couple of "Camera Alias" entries for Models which seemed to have different Internal Model Names depending on what part of the World the Camera was acquired. This may be one of these cases... If so, they can make another entry, and the fix will be in for the next point-release.

EXIF data on my camera "Camera model:NIKON Z 7_2"

Posted on DSS support forum here is the reply.

"all DSS is telling you is that your camera isn’t in the list of cameras that libraw claim to support. It’s a warning that things *may* not work as expected. Here’s what’s in the libraw source code:


"Nikon Z 5",
"Nikon Z 6",
"Nikon Z 6 II",
"Nikon Z 7",
"Nikon Z 7 II",
"Nikon Z 9 (HE/HE* formats are not supported yet)",

notice that your camera reported “Z 7_2” *not* “Z 7 II”

If they don’t list your camera in their supported camera list exactly as reported in the RAW file metadata, there’s nothing I can do to second guess it.

I’ve made a Pull request on their source repository to change their code for the future."