Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

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Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#1

Post by LDW47 »


I am looking at replacing my Baader 21mm Hyperion with the Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge. Good plan or poor plan ? Is it worth it or not worth it ? My 5 refractors range from f5 to f11.4. My ep collection was Hyperion / Morpheus but I am impressed with a couple Edges so I thought I might try one more. Any thoughts ?
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#2

Post by Ylem »


I have an Orion 24mm 68° that looks very similar, it's my favourite EP. I use it in everything from an f7.5 refractor to my slow CATs never disappoints :)

I would certainly recommend it, you could always return if you had to.
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#3

Post by Bigzmey »


I can't comment on Ultima Edge, but I have ES68 24mm and it is a great performer in fast and slow scopes.

https://agenaastro.com/explore-scientif ... -24mm.html
Scopes: Stellarvue: SV102ED; Celestron: 9.25" EdgeHD, 8" SCT, 150ST, Onyx 80ED; iOptron: Hankmeister 6" Mak; SW: 7" Mak; Meade: 80ST.
Mounts: SW: SkyTee2, AzGTi; iOptron: AZMP; ES: Twilight I; Bresser: EXOS2; UA: MicroStar.
Binos: APM: 100-90 APO; Canon: IS 15x50; Orion: Binoviewer, LG II 15x70, WV 10x50, Nikon: AE 16x50, 10x50, 8x40.
EPs: Pentax: XWs & XFs; TeleVue: Delites, Panoptic & Plossls; ES: 68, 62; Vixen: SLVs; Baader: BCOs, Aspherics, Mark IV.
Diagonals: Baader: BBHS mirror, Zeiss Spec T2 prism, Clicklock dielectric; TeleVue: Evebrite dielectric; AltairAstro: 2" prism.
Filters: Lumicon: DeepSky, UHC, OIII, H-beta; Baader: Moon & SkyGlow, Contrast Booster, UHC-S, 6-color set; Astronomik: UHC.

Observing: DSOs: 3106 (Completed: Messier, Herschel 1, 2, 3. In progress: H2,500: 2180, S110: 77). Doubles: 2382, Comets: 34, Asteroids: 255
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#4

Post by Don Pensack »


These are all the same eyepiece. Shop price:
APM Ultra Flat Field
Altair Ultra Flat (green)
Celestron Ultima Edge
Meade Series 5000 UHD
Orion Ultra Flat Field
Sky Rover Ultra Flat Field
Stella Lyra (FLO) Ultra Flat
Tecnosky UltraFlatField
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#5

Post by Lady Fraktor »


If you do not mind used, the Vixen 22mm LVW is a much better eyepiece
See Far Sticks: Antares Elita 103/1575, AOM FLT 105/1000, Bresser BV 127/1200, Nočný stopár 152/1200, Vyrobené doma 70/700, Stellarvue NHNG DX 80/552, TAL RS100/1000, Vixen SD115s/885
EQ: TAL MT-1, Vixen SXP, AXJ, AXD
Az/Alt: AYO Digi II/ Argo Navis, Stellarvue M2C/ Argo Navis
Tripods: Berlebach Planet (2), Uni 28 Astro, Report 372, TAL factory maple, Vixen ASG-CB90, Vixen AXD-TR102
Diagonals: Astro-Physics, Baader Amici, Baader Herschel, iStar Blue, Stellarvue DX, Takahashi prism, TAL, Vixen flip mirror
Eyepieces: Antares to Zeiss
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#6

Post by LDW47 »


Lady Fraktor wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2023 8:00 pm If you do not mind used, the Vixen 22mm LVW is a much better eyepiece
I am not against used but up here in Canada it will be almost impossible to find one in a timely way unless I just hit it lucky. I don't intend to wait forever until one might happen to show up on the used market, it could be a long time, if ever. It took me a decade to find an NP101 up here in Canada, the astro market is pretty thin and restricted.
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#7

Post by LDW47 »


Lady Fraktor wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2023 8:00 pm If you do not mind used, the Vixen 22mm LVW is a much better eyepiece
In what way is the LVW much better from your experience ?
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#8

Post by LDW47 »


Based on the supposed fact that there are similar brands out there with similar same eyepieces and the difficulty of getting some with little $ difference I was hoping the small cost difference would not come up as an / the issue. I am interested in performance, build quality etc. being the deciding, convincing factor. Slight differences in $ is not always a concern there are a lot more important concerns in my mind !
Last edited by LDW47 on Sun Feb 19, 2023 1:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#9

Post by Don Pensack »


Lady Fraktor wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2023 8:00 pm If you do not mind used, the Vixen 22mm LVW is a much better eyepiece [than the APM 24mm]
Almost a 20% smaller field stop diameter, though.
The modern equivalent to the LVW 22 is the Astromania SWA/Omegon Redline 22mm which is easily the LVW's equal.
But, it is a 2", where the LVW was a 1.25".
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#10

Post by LDW47 »


After many years of 2" ep use I have gone back to 1.25" in most cases, wherever possible, since I went to the Hyperion / Morpheus lines. I like their performance, the FOV / TFOV that my scopes give me.
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#11

Post by Lady Fraktor »


LDW47, when I compared the Hyperion I found that the LVW overall view sharper and more pleasing. Not as much detail and something about the Hyperions just struck as being a bit 'soft' in the overall view. Refractor used at the time was a TMB 105 mm f/6.2

I may have a biased opinion on the LVW as they are still here whereas the Hyperion and a set of Radian were moved along.
I will say that I do like the Hyperion 31 and 36 mm though.

The Morpheus are very nice and I find they are much better than the Hyperion.
See Far Sticks: Antares Elita 103/1575, AOM FLT 105/1000, Bresser BV 127/1200, Nočný stopár 152/1200, Vyrobené doma 70/700, Stellarvue NHNG DX 80/552, TAL RS100/1000, Vixen SD115s/885
EQ: TAL MT-1, Vixen SXP, AXJ, AXD
Az/Alt: AYO Digi II/ Argo Navis, Stellarvue M2C/ Argo Navis
Tripods: Berlebach Planet (2), Uni 28 Astro, Report 372, TAL factory maple, Vixen ASG-CB90, Vixen AXD-TR102
Diagonals: Astro-Physics, Baader Amici, Baader Herschel, iStar Blue, Stellarvue DX, Takahashi prism, TAL, Vixen flip mirror
Eyepieces: Antares to Zeiss
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#12

Post by LDW47 »


Lady Fraktor wrote: Sun Feb 19, 2023 3:34 am LDW47, when I compared the Hyperion I found that the LVW overall view sharper and more pleasing. Not as much detail and something about the Hyperions just struck as being a bit 'soft' in the overall view. Refractor used at the time was a TMB 105 mm f/6.2

I may have a biased opinion on the LVW as they are still here whereas the Hyperion and a set of Radian were moved along.
I will say that I do like the Hyperion 31 and 36 mm though.

The Morpheus are very nice and I find they are much better than the Hyperion.
Thats why I switched to he Morpheus line from the Hyperion line but right now as per this thread my focus is on the 24mm Ultima Edge to go with the Morpheuses and to replace my 21 Hyperion.
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#13

Post by LDW47 »


I think I am starting to realize the answer to my OP !
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#14

Post by Don Pensack »


As a contrary note, if you own a 17.5mm Morpheus, the 24mm UFF is too close in magnification in scopes under 2000-2500mm focal lengths.
I would suggest the 30mm UFF instead.
First, it's a seriously larger true and apparent field of view.
Second because the field is flatter.
Third, because the edge of the field is sharper.
Fourth, because the magnification is a bit farther from the 17.5mm.
Fifth, because it works better in shorter f/ratio scopes.
Sixth, because it is a bit more glasses-friendly.
Seventh, because it has less chromatic edge-of-field issues than the 24mm.
Eighth, because the field stop is in focus.
Yes, it's 2", but it's a better choice for a lower power and WAY, WAY, WAY better than the 31mm Baader Hyperion.
It's a high-end eyepiece with an inexpensive selling price.
It's available in the same brands as my earlier post in this thread.
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#15

Post by LDW47 »


Don Pensack wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 4:29 pm As a contrary note, if you own a 17.5mm Morpheus, the 24mm UFF is too close in magnification in scopes under 2000-2500mm focal lengths.
I would suggest the 30mm UFF instead.
First, it's a seriously larger true and apparent field of view.
Second because the field is flatter.
Third, because the edge of the field is sharper.
Fourth, because the magnification is a bit farther from the 17.5mm.
Fifth, because it works better in shorter f/ratio scopes.
Sixth, because it is a bit more glasses-friendly.
Seventh, because it has less chromatic edge-of-field issues than the 24mm.
Eighth, because the field stop is in focus.
Yes, it's 2", but it's a better choice for a lower power and WAY, WAY, WAY better than the 31mm Baader Hyperion.
It's a high-end eyepiece with an inexpensive selling price.
It's available in the same brands as my earlier post in this thread.
I already have the 30mm Edge (2") with great views but I want the 24mm to use with my smaller scopes that are restricted to 1.25". As far as being close to my 17.5mm Morpheus, sometimes i like just a little more or less mag. on those certain nites, its my viewing habits and it works for me. Its enjoyable when the $ isn't considered !
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#16

Post by Bigzmey »


LDW47 wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 5:14 pm
Don Pensack wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 4:29 pm As a contrary note, if you own a 17.5mm Morpheus, the 24mm UFF is too close in magnification in scopes under 2000-2500mm focal lengths.
I would suggest the 30mm UFF instead.
First, it's a seriously larger true and apparent field of view.
Second because the field is flatter.
Third, because the edge of the field is sharper.
Fourth, because the magnification is a bit farther from the 17.5mm.
Fifth, because it works better in shorter f/ratio scopes.
Sixth, because it is a bit more glasses-friendly.
Seventh, because it has less chromatic edge-of-field issues than the 24mm.
Eighth, because the field stop is in focus.
Yes, it's 2", but it's a better choice for a lower power and WAY, WAY, WAY better than the 31mm Baader Hyperion.
It's a high-end eyepiece with an inexpensive selling price.
It's available in the same brands as my earlier post in this thread.
I already have the 30mm Edge (2") with great views but I want the 24mm to use with my smaller scopes that are restricted to 1.25". As far as being close to my 17.5mm Morpheus, sometimes i like just a little more or less mag. on those certain nites, its my viewing habits and it works for me. Its enjoyable when the $ isn't considered !
24mm is ~1.4x step from 17.5mm. I would not say it is too close. Depends on type of targets. For faint fuzzies I find 1.3x - 1.4x spacing about right.
Scopes: Stellarvue: SV102ED; Celestron: 9.25" EdgeHD, 8" SCT, 150ST, Onyx 80ED; iOptron: Hankmeister 6" Mak; SW: 7" Mak; Meade: 80ST.
Mounts: SW: SkyTee2, AzGTi; iOptron: AZMP; ES: Twilight I; Bresser: EXOS2; UA: MicroStar.
Binos: APM: 100-90 APO; Canon: IS 15x50; Orion: Binoviewer, LG II 15x70, WV 10x50, Nikon: AE 16x50, 10x50, 8x40.
EPs: Pentax: XWs & XFs; TeleVue: Delites, Panoptic & Plossls; ES: 68, 62; Vixen: SLVs; Baader: BCOs, Aspherics, Mark IV.
Diagonals: Baader: BBHS mirror, Zeiss Spec T2 prism, Clicklock dielectric; TeleVue: Evebrite dielectric; AltairAstro: 2" prism.
Filters: Lumicon: DeepSky, UHC, OIII, H-beta; Baader: Moon & SkyGlow, Contrast Booster, UHC-S, 6-color set; Astronomik: UHC.

Observing: DSOs: 3106 (Completed: Messier, Herschel 1, 2, 3. In progress: H2,500: 2180, S110: 77). Doubles: 2382, Comets: 34, Asteroids: 255
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#17

Post by Don Pensack »


Yes, but a 1.4 spacing is too close at low power.
Example: 1250mm focal length:
30mm = 42x.
24mm = 52x
17.5mm = 71x.
The 30 to 17.5mm jump is only 29x, which is a small jump in magnification any way you look at it.
If the focal length is shorter, that jump is even smaller and makes even less sense.

And a 1.4x spacing is too much at high power.
300 becomes 420x, and most people would say a 120x jump is a bit too large when you might be bumping up against seeing.

So, though the 1.4x rule is followed by Pentax XW and Baader Morpheus in the focal lengths sequences, it doesn't always work.
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#18

Post by Bigzmey »


And difference between 10x and 15x is only 5x jump, but boy what a difference it makes for binos. 1.4x increase in power it is still 40% difference no matter when you go from 10x or from 100x, it is just the math.
Scopes: Stellarvue: SV102ED; Celestron: 9.25" EdgeHD, 8" SCT, 150ST, Onyx 80ED; iOptron: Hankmeister 6" Mak; SW: 7" Mak; Meade: 80ST.
Mounts: SW: SkyTee2, AzGTi; iOptron: AZMP; ES: Twilight I; Bresser: EXOS2; UA: MicroStar.
Binos: APM: 100-90 APO; Canon: IS 15x50; Orion: Binoviewer, LG II 15x70, WV 10x50, Nikon: AE 16x50, 10x50, 8x40.
EPs: Pentax: XWs & XFs; TeleVue: Delites, Panoptic & Plossls; ES: 68, 62; Vixen: SLVs; Baader: BCOs, Aspherics, Mark IV.
Diagonals: Baader: BBHS mirror, Zeiss Spec T2 prism, Clicklock dielectric; TeleVue: Evebrite dielectric; AltairAstro: 2" prism.
Filters: Lumicon: DeepSky, UHC, OIII, H-beta; Baader: Moon & SkyGlow, Contrast Booster, UHC-S, 6-color set; Astronomik: UHC.

Observing: DSOs: 3106 (Completed: Messier, Herschel 1, 2, 3. In progress: H2,500: 2180, S110: 77). Doubles: 2382, Comets: 34, Asteroids: 255
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#19

Post by Don Pensack »


I advocate for a sliding % change, or a "noticeable difference in appearance change" in the object.
In a very small scope, or for terrestrial use, that could be a 20-30x magnification change.
But by the time you get to an 8" scope, 50x, 100x, 150x, 200x will work fine, and that is an increase from low power of 100%, 50%, 33.3%, 25%, etc.
You might prefer a smaller jump than 50x, but I've owned and used scopes of 80-100mm, and almost never did i find that a magnification change of less than 30x was worthwhile.
Even in my current 4", 40x jumps seem fine: 30x/70x/110x/150x.
Because I have a larger scope, with a longer focal length, I do have other eyepieces, but those 4 are close to all I need in my 4" apo.

So a flat % change just doesn't work if what you want to see when changing magnification on an object is a different view of the object.

A further example: My 12.5" scope with a 40% change, starting at 100x:
100x
140x (a reasonable jump)
196x (a tad too much change, but I could live with that)
274x (this might be stretching a bit, but I could see it for certain objects)
384x (this magnification change is a bit excessive. I'd find myself wanting something in between, a lot.)
538x (I can use this power fairly often because my site has good seeing, but the jump is just too large. Seeing dictates the maximum magnification, and the jump would be too large too much of the time).

The point I'm making is that the % change should be determined by factors other than a % change. If the object barely appears any different when changing magnification, then the jump is too small.

I say that knowing I have too many eyepieces and need to get rid of some. That's a Sophie's Choice when you love them all.
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Re: Celestron 24mm Ultima Edge

#20

Post by Bigzmey »


There's more than one way to catch a rabbit (don't like the cat's version :D) and as you mentioned it is all about "noticeable difference in appearance change". For my scopes and targets stepping from 24mm to 18mm makes perfect sense, for you it may not. It just seems odd to me that you are discouraging OP to get 24mm based on "it is too small of a step".
Scopes: Stellarvue: SV102ED; Celestron: 9.25" EdgeHD, 8" SCT, 150ST, Onyx 80ED; iOptron: Hankmeister 6" Mak; SW: 7" Mak; Meade: 80ST.
Mounts: SW: SkyTee2, AzGTi; iOptron: AZMP; ES: Twilight I; Bresser: EXOS2; UA: MicroStar.
Binos: APM: 100-90 APO; Canon: IS 15x50; Orion: Binoviewer, LG II 15x70, WV 10x50, Nikon: AE 16x50, 10x50, 8x40.
EPs: Pentax: XWs & XFs; TeleVue: Delites, Panoptic & Plossls; ES: 68, 62; Vixen: SLVs; Baader: BCOs, Aspherics, Mark IV.
Diagonals: Baader: BBHS mirror, Zeiss Spec T2 prism, Clicklock dielectric; TeleVue: Evebrite dielectric; AltairAstro: 2" prism.
Filters: Lumicon: DeepSky, UHC, OIII, H-beta; Baader: Moon & SkyGlow, Contrast Booster, UHC-S, 6-color set; Astronomik: UHC.

Observing: DSOs: 3106 (Completed: Messier, Herschel 1, 2, 3. In progress: H2,500: 2180, S110: 77). Doubles: 2382, Comets: 34, Asteroids: 255
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