Tele Vue 9mm Nagler T6

[Razz]

I just purchased an Apertura AD10, should have it next week, and I've read many reviews. The one thing that seems to be a constant is to replace the supplied 9mm. I won't be doing this right away but I'm looking at different eyepieces and I'm leaning towards the Tele Vue 9mm Nagler T6...Would this be a good replacement for the supplied eyepiece? Any other suggestions? Any opinions/advice will be appreciated...

[notFritzArgelander]

I recommend trying before buying. There is a small minority of folks who can't stand the wide field of view at 80 degrees AFOV. They get seasick looking through them. I owned 2 sets of Naglers and disposed of both of them. The second set I bought because I talked myself into giving them another shot. So check with a local club and try first, otherwise there is a small chance of an expensive mistake.

At longer focal lengths I prefer TV Panoptics and at shorter focal lengths, like 9mm, I'd prefer the 8mm or 10mm Delos. TV has a 9mm Delite that I haven't tried yet but there are folks here who like them and I might just switch over from Delos to Delite sacrificing a little AFOV for lower weight.

If you are among the many who can stand an 82 degree AFOV go for the Nagler. But checking first is advisable.

[Lady Fraktor]

The supplied 9mm is a decent Plossl and will work fine starting out.

If this is your first telescope I would recommend you not start buying high end eyepieces right away.
Use your telescope with a few basic ones for a while.
You will then gain knowledge on what you like to view and better understanding of the type of eyepiece you will require.
In the mean time you will not be buying eyepieces you may never use.

[Razz]

Thanks for the replies...It's not my first scope...It's my second...lol...It's my first Newtonian, however...I don't plan on buying anything right away, I was just exploring options...

[notFritzArgelander]

Thanks for the replies...It's not my first scope...It's my second...lol...It's my first Newtonian, however...I don't plan on buying anything right away, I was just exploring options...

That’s a reasonable approach. The wide field eyepieces are a convenient choice for dobsonian scopes since you don’t have to nudge the scope to track so often. The price paid for the convenience is higher cost AND poorer contrast and light transmission.

Long ago I did a direct careful comparison of Delos to KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics and found that the less expensive KKs were better at making an excellent contrast image.

[Lady Fraktor]

I have rid myself of the Nagler eyepieces for pretty much the same reasons as nFA.
The only eyepieces labelled Nagler I still have are the 2-4mm and 3-6mm variable eyepieces.

I would highly recommend the Baader Morpheus 9mm though. Excellent eyepiece.
https://www.baader-planetarium.com/en/a ... pheus.html

[Bigzmey]

EPs provided with AD10 are very basic and sooner or later you do want to get 2-3 better quality EPs. Since you have a manual mount you would definitely appreciate wide field EPs. I would aim for 68-82 deg FOV. There many good quality EPs in these range. The problem, as nFA and Gabby indicated, is that people develop preferences for particular designs, and what I like would not necessary be the best choice for you. So, you have to try them in your scope and see what you like and what you don't.

My advice is to buy EPs used or on sale, then if you don't like it you can re-sell at minimal loss.

Like nFA and Gabby, my EP set in the past consisted of variety of 82 deg EPs, but I sold them in favor of Pentax XWs. So, my recommendation is Pentax XW 10mm.

Still, it does not mean that 82 deg EPs would not work for you. If you decide to try I suggest to go with Explore Scientific 11mm or Meade 5000 UWA 8.8mm. They perform very similar to Naglers and cost less. They also come used fairly often on Cloudy Nights and Astromart classifieds.

[Razz]

Thank you for the reply and suggestions. At this point I'm just exploring options because I don't even have the scope yet...I think my biggest problem with eyepieces is while I understand the math, I'm not sure how it translates to actual views. At some point I need to just jump in and buy an eyepiece and go from there. Honestly, I think I make it more confusing than it needs to be...I'm a hands on person, I need to try something to see what it does and then make adjustments from there. What I have right now is a cheap set of eyepieces, a 2x Barlow and filters from Astromania, cost me $117...that's why I'm looking for better eyepieces...Lady Fraktor suggested Morpheus eyepieces and I'm looking into those as well...I've also been looking at Baader Hyperion zoom lenses...But, again, I need a baseline to start with and I figured the 9mm Nagler T6 was a good place to start...but, I will check out the eyepieces you suggested...Thank you all for your insight...

[Bigzmey]

TeleVue has a great following for a good reason. They turn out good quality EPs. I own quite few TV EPs and happy with there performance.

So, 9mm Nagler T6 is a good plays to start. Just keep in mind that there is a chance that you may not like it. My main complain in this case is a tight 12mm eye relief. I observe with eyeglasses on, and ideally looking for 18-20mm eye relief.

[Razz]

I realize that I may not like it but I have to start somewhere...Don't get me wrong, I do appreciate your opinion as well as the other knowledgeable people on this forum but, I do need to start somewhere....What are your thoughts about the Baader Hyperion line of eyepieces? I am very seriously considering buying the Baader Hyperion 8-24 zoom piece...But, as a novice, I see a zoom lens as an easy way out...It offers multiple magnifications with very little effort....Honestly, I'd rather put more money into quality pieces, if that makes sense....

[notFritzArgelander]

I realize that I may not like it but I have to start somewhere...Don't get me wrong, I do appreciate your opinion as well as the other knowledgeable people on this forum but, I do need to start somewhere....What are your thoughts about the Baader Hyperion line of eyepieces? I am very seriously considering buying the Baader Hyperion 8-24 zoom piece...But, as a novice, I see a zoom lens as an easy way out...It offers multiple magnifications with very little effort....Honestly, I'd rather put more money into quality pieces, if that makes sense....

I have a pair of the Baader Hyperion zooms which I use for binoviewing. They are very, very fine just a little bit short of the performance of a single focal length eyepiece. I use them to find the magnification that gives the best views then I switch to dedicated single focal lengths. I have pairs of BCOs and Vixen NPLs to get that last little bit of contrast.

I would not use the Baader Hyperions in a fast scope like your Apertura 10" f5. They have edge of field problems and are best in slower scopes.

Also, more $$$ does not necessarily mean higher quality optically. Try more and different setups. Experience is the best advisor.

[Razz]

Thank you for the advice, nFA, but let me ask you a question....How do I get experience if I don't buy and try things? The idea of a local astronomy club doesn't work for me so that means I have to buy and try as well as ask opinions on forums such as this...Everyone on any forum that I ask questions on has done the trial and error approach, bought something, tried it, liked it or didn't like it...Why am I different? I never said I wanted to spend a lot of money on eyepieces because it would make things better. At this point, I'm just exploring options and getting opinions....I've read a lot of your posts and I respect your opinion on this. You say the Hyperions are not good for the AD10, I believe you and your experience...How do you feel about a couple of Morpheus eyepieces and the Hyperion 8-24 zoom lens? Or maybe the Astro-Tech paradigm eyepieces?

[notFritzArgelander]

Thank you for the advice, nFA, but let me ask you a question....How do I get experience if I don't buy and try things? The idea of a local astronomy club doesn't work for me so that means I have to buy and try as well as ask opinions on forums such as this...Everyone on any forum that I ask questions on has done the trial and error approach, bought something, tried it, liked it or didn't like it...Why am I different? I never said I wanted to spend a lot of money on eyepieces because it would make things better. At this point, I'm just exploring options and getting opinions....I've read a lot of your posts and I respect your opinion on this. You say the Hyperions are not good for the AD10, I believe you and your experience...How do you feel about a couple of Morpheus eyepieces and the Hyperion 8-24 zoom lens? Or maybe the Astro-Tech paradigm eyepieces?

As a matter of fact, while I’m of the opinion that trying before buying is cost effective, I’m a bit of a hermit. There are a few occasions when I’ve had the opportunity to try before buy but mostly I’ve bought, tried, and resold what didn’t suit. By advising try before buy I know from experience that it’s more efficient.

I’ve no opinion about the Morpheus or the Paradigms.

I might be able to get an opinion on the Baader zooms in an f5 scope quickly for you.

[Bigzmey]

I am a member of astro club, but 90% of folks there doing AP only, so no luck with trying EPs. So, buy, try, sell, repeat is my only option. So, you are not alone there.

I guess if we are voting on EPs, I would not recommend Morpheus, Paradigms and Hyperions. Just based on my experience with those.

I have Baader Mark IV which I use with my travel scope. It is a good quality zoom, and as nFA says, approaches (but not equal) in performance to good fixed FL EPs. However, at the end, fixed FL EPs do outperform most of zooms. So, if you end game is to invest in a set of good single FL EPs, I would skip the zoom and save the money towards it. If you can afford buying set of signel FL EPs and the zoom, than the zoom could be a good starting point for you to start observing.

[Lady Fraktor]

I agree with nFA about the Hyperion not being good in fast telescopes. Even at f/7 I find the edge quality annoying.
Baader has been a outstanding company but the Hyperion range was disapointing.
The Hyperion zoom and aspheric 31mm/ 36mm are quite good though.
Luckily Baader made up for that mistake with the Morpheus line. All are very good but the 9mm and 17.5mm are outstanding.

(and they are cheaper than Naglers but not inferior)

If you want to try some decent lower cost eyepieces that will be much better than your kit, look at Celestron X-Cel LX or used Meade HD-60
Quite good and will work with your newtonian and refractor.

[notFritzArgelander]

I agree with nFA about the Hyperion not being good in fast telescopes. Even at f/7 I find the edge quality annoying.
Baader has been a outstanding company but the Hyperion range was disapointing.
The Hyperion zoom and aspheric 31mm/ 36mm are quite good though.
Luckily Baader made up for that mistake with the Morpheus line. All are very good but the 9mm and 17.5mm are outstanding.

(and they are cheaper than Naglers but not inferior)

If you want to try some decent lower cost eyepieces that will be much better than your kit, look at Celestron X-Cel LX or used Meade HD-60
Quite good and will work with your newtonian and refractor.

Interesting about the Morpheus. I’ll keep that in mind.

The Celestron X-Cel-LX and Meade HD-60 are the same design and work fine at f5 and a little faster.

[Bigzmey]

Morpheus seems to be one of those EP lines which people either love or can't stand. No neutral opinions there. I am in the latter group.

I was thinking about what EPs I can recommend based on my own experience and most of them comes with BUT. BCOs - sharp, great light scatter control, high transmission, BUT tight eye relief in shorter FL. Pentax XWs - sharp, high transmission, coatings quality is second to none, long eye relief, BUT longer focal length exhibit strong field curvature in fast newts. ES82 - sharp, high transmission, BUT short effective eye relief and patchy coatings. You got the idea.

The only line I could not come with any BUTs is TV Delites. They also seems to be universally loved, I don't think I ever saw any owner not liking them. So, IMO this is the safest buy of good quality EP I can think of.

[notFritzArgelander]

Morpheus seems to be one of those EP lines which people either love or can't stand. No neutral opinions there. I am in the latter group.

I was thinking about what EPs I can recommend based on my own experience and most of them comes with BUT. BCOs - sharp, great light scatter control, high transmission, BUT tight eye relief in shorter FL. Pentax XWs - sharp, high transmission, coatings quality is second to none, long eye relief, BUT longer focal length exhibit strong field curvature in fast newts. ES82 - sharp, high transmission, BUT short effective eye relief and patchy coatings. You got the idea.

The only line I could not come with any BUTs is TV Delites. They also seems to be universally loved, I don't think I ever saw any owner not liking them. So, IMO this is the safest buy of good quality EP I can think of.

I also like my Delos although they are not as contrasty as the BCOs or as sharp as the KKs. The BUT with them is their weight. I am thinking about Delites.

[Bigzmey]

Morpheus seems to be one of those EP lines which people either love or can't stand. No neutral opinions there. I am in the latter group.

I was thinking about what EPs I can recommend based on my own experience and most of them comes with BUT. BCOs - sharp, great light scatter control, high transmission, BUT tight eye relief in shorter FL. Pentax XWs - sharp, high transmission, coatings quality is second to none, long eye relief, BUT longer focal length exhibit strong field curvature in fast newts. ES82 - sharp, high transmission, BUT short effective eye relief and patchy coatings. You got the idea.

The only line I could not come with any BUTs is TV Delites. They also seems to be universally loved, I don't think I ever saw any owner not liking them. So, IMO this is the safest buy of good quality EP I can think of.

I also like my Delos although they are not as contrasty as the BCOs or as sharp as the KKs. The BUT with them is their weight. I am thinking about Delites.

I had a brief encounter with Delos 17.3mm and it did not click with me. The form factor, eyeguard design, large exposed top lens, and too sensitive eye position are the BUTs for me.

[notFritzArgelander]

Morpheus seems to be one of those EP lines which people either love or can't stand. No neutral opinions there. I am in the latter group.

I was thinking about what EPs I can recommend based on my own experience and most of them comes with BUT. BCOs - sharp, great light scatter control, high transmission, BUT tight eye relief in shorter FL. Pentax XWs - sharp, high transmission, coatings quality is second to none, long eye relief, BUT longer focal length exhibit strong field curvature in fast newts. ES82 - sharp, high transmission, BUT short effective eye relief and patchy coatings. You got the idea.

The only line I could not come with any BUTs is TV Delites. They also seems to be universally loved, I don't think I ever saw any owner not liking them. So, IMO this is the safest buy of good quality EP I can think of.

I also like my Delos although they are not as contrasty as the BCOs or as sharp as the KKs. The BUT with them is their weight. I am thinking about Delites.

I had a brief encounter with Delos 17.3mm and it did not click with me. The form factor, eyeguard design, large exposed top lens, and too sensitive eye position are the BUTs for me.

For me it's just the weight.