DSLR used for astrophotography???

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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#21

Post by UlteriorModem »


Were you down a well when you took that? Whats with all the vigenetting around the corners?

It looks out of focus, and some movement perhaps. That was shot at night? Neighbors have bright lights on?
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

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Post by metastable »


I recommend not going over 10 seconds because the stars will look like trails due to the earth’s rotation if you go longer. I also recommend driving very far from any major cities, the photo I took was probably 100 miles from any large city. I also recommend shooting before moonrise or after moonset, as the moon will cause significant skyglow (i check these times using google). focus can be very tricky- if your camera has a live preview you’ll want to zoom into it, look at a star and manually adjust the focus ring till it turns into a point (you’ll want to be in manual focus mode). hope it helps.
Last edited by metastable on Fri Jan 10, 2020 4:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#23

Post by metastable »


also raw processing is key for a good result... i posted the settings i used in an earlier post, here is the “in camera” vs “processed” look...
metastable wrote: Sat Dec 28, 2019 10:39 am
shooting in raw brings out a lot of detail:

Image

same image “in camera”:
Image
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#24

Post by lsintampa »


UlteriorModem wrote: Fri Jan 10, 2020 4:43 pm Were you down a well when you took that? Whats with all the vigenetting around the corners?

It looks out of focus, and some movement perhaps. That was shot at night? Neighbors have bright lights on?

In my driveway, shooting up between oak trees. Near full moon, nearby Street lamp.
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#25

Post by lsintampa »


metastable wrote: Fri Jan 10, 2020 4:50 pm also raw processing is key for a good result... i posted the settings i used in an earlier post, here is the “in camera” vs “processed” look...
metastable wrote: Sat Dec 28, 2019 10:39 am
shooting in raw brings out a lot of detail:

Image

same image “in camera”:
Image

Is this just one photo or stacked?
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

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Post by metastable »


single photo
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#27

Post by lsintampa »


Regarding Nikon DSLR's

How important is the sensor size: IE DX or FX and why?
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#28

Post by metastable »


based on my current understanding of camera bodies, for astrophotography the low noise dynamic range of the sensor is the most important factor (allowing you to bump up the ISO/sensitivity without adding too much noise).

when it came first came out, the nikon d800 I use had by far the best low noise dynamic range of any dslr, and a very respectable 36 megapixels. the current version (nikon d850) will set you back $3000 and has 45 megapixels.

https://www.nikonusa.com/en/nikon-produ ... /d850.html

but recently sony has been making inroads into the digital camera market with their mirrorless bodies...

...so if you have $2400 to spend on body alone, my understanding is this one (Sony α7S II) has the best dynamic range that's available right now, but the tradeoff is it has "only" 12megapixels...

https://www.sony.com/electronics/interc ... /ilce-7sm2

if resolution is what you're after this one (Sony α7R IV) will give you 61 megapixels for $3500...

https://www.sony.com/electronics/interc ... /ilce-7rm4
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

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Post by metastable »


this video has a pretty good demonstration of the sensitivity prowess of the Sony α7S II:



and this one, filmed entirely in moonlight, apparently:

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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

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Post by OzEclipse »


Hi,
Yes it is significantly out of focus, and you have a hair or string of dust on the AA filter in front of the sensor.
ISINTAMPA_SC_0026.jpg
Old cameras like this usually don't have live view referred to in another post.
You will need to focus by trial and error inspecting the previews at magnification to determine correct focus.

Joe
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#31

Post by yobbo89 »


lsintampa wrote: Fri Jan 10, 2020 3:45 pm took one of the NEF files - opened in photo editor - saved as jpg
that's a very bright image, i can see about 5 diffraction circles /airy disc , looks like you're out of focus by a mile or km for us metric users.
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#32

Post by lsintampa »


OzEclipse wrote: Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:06 pm Hi,
Yes it is significantly out of focus, and you have a hair or string of dust on the AA filter in front of the sensor.

Old cameras like this usually don't have live view referred to in another post.
You will need to focus by trial and error inspecting the previews at magnification to determine correct focus.

Joe
Thanks - got better I think with these..... Keep in mind - no live view - only 6mp DSLr - and just a start for me..... just trying to see if this is worth chasing - the D50 may not be the best camera for what I'm trying to do - but as I originally stated - for me this is a proof of concept exercise....
DSC_0035.jpg
DSC_0034.jpg
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

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Post by OzEclipse »


lsintampa wrote: Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:42 am
OzEclipse wrote: Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:06 pm Hi,
Yes it is significantly out of focus, and you have a hair or string of dust on the AA filter in front of the sensor.

Old cameras like this usually don't have live view referred to in another post.
You will need to focus by trial and error inspecting the previews at magnification to determine correct focus.

Joe
Thanks - got better I think with these..... Keep in mind - no live view - only 6mp DSLr - and just a start for me..... just trying to see if this is worth chasing - the D50 may not be the best camera for what I'm trying to do - but as I originally stated - for me this is a proof of concept exercise....

DSC_0035.jpg

DSC_0034.jpg
Yes much better but still not focused.
You just have to focus by trial and error. Push the ISO up, the aperture to its widest setting. Then you can use short exposures for the trial and error focusing. That's how I did it on my pre-Liveview camera. If you are using a zoom, focus may change as you zoom the lens so choose and set the focal length first, don't touch the zoom, then focus, then set the ISO, aperture and shutter speed to the final acquisition settings then make your exposure.

Joe
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#34

Post by ARock »


It would be great if you could take and view pictures from a laptop, to catch focus problems. Unfortunately most windows applications do not seem to support the D50. I had similar problems with my D70s and finally ended up using gphoto2 (free) on Linux. But you need to be familiar with Linux and have a Linux laptop or a raspberry pi.

http://www.gphoto.org/proj/libgphoto2/support.php
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

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Post by yobbo89 »


I started my journey in astrophotography with a nikon d60 about 5 years ago and now i remember how frustrating the thing was to focus on stars without live view, there's very little you can do with the viewfinder to get critical focus on a small view, essentially you have to take an image then preview the image ,zoom in on the previewed image have a look at the stars and then adjust the focuser a tiny bit and repeat until the stars are small and tight.
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#36

Post by yobbo89 »


metastable wrote: Fri Jan 10, 2020 10:00 pm based on my current understanding of camera bodies, for astrophotography the low noise dynamic range of the sensor is the most important factor (allowing you to bump up the ISO/sensitivity without adding too much noise).

when it came first came out, the nikon d800 I use had by far the best low noise dynamic range of any dslr, and a very respectable 36 megapixels. the current version (nikon d850) will set you back $3000 and has 45 megapixels.

https://www.nikonusa.com/en/nikon-produ ... /d850.html

but recently sony has been making inroads into the digital camera market with their mirrorless bodies...

...so if you have $2400 to spend on body alone, my understanding is this one (Sony α7S II) has the best dynamic range that's available right now, but the tradeoff is it has "only" 12megapixels...

https://www.sony.com/electronics/interc ... /ilce-7sm2

if resolution is what you're after this one (Sony α7R IV) will give you 61 megapixels for $3500...

https://www.sony.com/electronics/interc ... /ilce-7rm4
A lot of these newer cameras are improving elsewhere in their designs , like image 5 axis image stabilization which is great and could aid in longer exposures for astrophotography without tracking,faster autofocus for sports/bird photography ectt. . but for a dedicated astro camera i think top of the line is a bit of a waste $$ for just astrophotography due to price/performance,they seem to excel in single image nightscape but There's still plenty of cheaper dslr chips that just kill in deep sky astro /nightscape at a fraction of the price ,i have my a7 original and i think it was released in 2013-2014 and it still competes in low light performance , may not be the best q.e or lowist read noise, dynamic range, but software can take care of that with stacking and more integration/ hdr processing ectt. even a $3500 dslr in all it's might will suffer in low signal h alpha regions without a filter removal mod.

dedicated Astronomy cameras are slowing catching up, zwo is starting to introduced full frame 62mp 16 bit 80% q.e cooled cameras at similar price of a modern new gen dslr. and the ability of having suitable functions for astro, high speed imaging with roi ,binning,cooling ectt.
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

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Post by Graeme1858 »


ARock wrote: Sun Jan 12, 2020 5:07 am It would be great if you could take and view pictures from a laptop, to catch focus problems. Unfortunately most windows applications do not seem to support the D50. I had similar problems with my D70s and finally ended up using gphoto2 (free) on Linux. But you need to be familiar with Linux and have a Linux laptop or a raspberry pi.

Same with my Sony Alpha A350. So I bought a Canon 600D from Ebay for £180. Second hand but a good price for what it is and it has the capability of connecting to a pc for accurate focussing (with a Bahtinov mask) and ease of image capture control.

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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#38

Post by Juno16 »


lsintampa,

I could be wrong, but without live view, it will be nearly impossible to focus accurately. You can’t zoom in to use a batinov mask. Even if DigicamControl supports the camera, without the lv camera function, you still have the focus issue.
When shooting stars, “close” focus isn’t good enough.
Used dlsr’s that work well for astro ave available for very low prices on ebay. I bought my Nikon D5300 for $250 on ebay with less than 2k shutter clicks. I have seen Canon t3i’s for less than $200.

Just a thought.

Jim
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#39

Post by JayTee »


It is possible to achieve acceptable focus from your DSLR lens set at 20mm but it ain't easy. You definitely need a Bahtinov mask (they're cheap at that size) plus live view just wasn't good enough to tell if the lens was in focus or not. I had to hook up my laptop to use its screen to see a big enough image to judge how well I was focused. I had to take a series of nearly 50 test images to gain as good a focus as the lens would allow, that took nearly 45 minutes. I swear that the increment I needed to move the focus ring felt like .5mm which makes it incredibly easy to go right past the focus point every time. I was also at 6500' and at around 20°F which made it even more difficult.

Anyway, use a mask and be patient, eventually, you'll get a focused image.

Cheers,
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Re: DSLR used for astrophotography???

#40

Post by metastable »


This is a comparison from my most recent astrophotography excursion (shot near turntable bay at lake shasta in northern california, 1-6-20 3:30am PST) of my first shot (with the lens focus turned all the way to "infinity") compared to the next shot (after I zoomed into the live preview while adjusting the focus) on a nikon d800 with a nikon 14-24mm lens @ 14mm shot in raw, 10sec, 2.8f, 2000 iso, w/ light room settings Temp: 4637k, Tint: +2, Exposure: -0.97, Contrast: +87, Highlights: -100, Shadows: +100, Whites:+73, Blacks: +100, Clarity: +22, Dehaze: -1, Vibrance: -61, Saturation: -40:

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