anti Dark Matter?
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anti Dark Matter?
nFA,
I just googled a bit and figured I'd ask you now.
could there be anti Dark Matter?
regular matter and energy can be transformed into each other.
and regular antimatter exists.
so, could we say that there is also
anti energy?
or is that not quite how it works?
could there be anti Dark Energy?
thank you for any thoughts,
Charlie
here are some links to stuff I found:
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586- ... %20objects.
https://home.cern/news/news/physics/pro ... antimatter
and just for fun, I wondered if there could be Dark Matter Stars, and found this.
if there are, I wonder what would happen if one went supernova.
here's an article. Forbes is giving me 4 free articles (don't know if that means per month or forever.)
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jillianscu ... 7fd49821ea
I just googled a bit and figured I'd ask you now.
could there be anti Dark Matter?
regular matter and energy can be transformed into each other.
and regular antimatter exists.
so, could we say that there is also
anti energy?
or is that not quite how it works?
could there be anti Dark Energy?
thank you for any thoughts,
Charlie
here are some links to stuff I found:
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586- ... %20objects.
https://home.cern/news/news/physics/pro ... antimatter
and just for fun, I wondered if there could be Dark Matter Stars, and found this.
if there are, I wonder what would happen if one went supernova.
here's an article. Forbes is giving me 4 free articles (don't know if that means per month or forever.)
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jillianscu ... 7fd49821ea
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
I'd prefer the term dark antimatter. And yes, everything we know about quantum field theory says that all particles of matter have corresponding particles of antimatter. The antimatter particle that corresponds to a particle of matter has opposite charges (remember that there is more than just electric charge in the Standard Model, there are other charges corresponding to other fields. The mass remains the same though, which is important to remember because....chasmanian wrote: ↑Sun Feb 28, 2021 12:56 am nFA,
I just googled a bit and figured I'd ask you now.
could there be anti Dark Matter?
Energy density (apart from exceptions due to playing havoc with the vacuum with local small changes) is always positive. Remember above that for antimatter the mass stays the same but only charges (and parity and time reversal see the CPT Theorem for details) but the mass stays the same.regular matter and energy can be transformed into each other.
and regular antimatter exists.
so, could we say that there is also
anti energy?
or is that not quite how it works?
could there be anti Dark Energy?
You're always welcome.thank you for any thoughts,
Charlie
These links look interesting.here are some links to stuff I found:
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586- ... %20objects.
https://home.cern/news/news/physics/pro ... antimatter
But this one seems to me to be nonsense. For an assemblage of dark matter to produce light it would have to be charged and then it wouldn't be dark anymore.and just for fun, I wondered if there could be Dark Matter Stars, and found this.
if there are, I wonder what would happen if one went supernova.
here's an article. Forbes is giving me 4 free articles (don't know if that means per month or forever.)
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jillianscu ... 7fd49821ea
Scopes: Refs: Orion ST80, SV 80EDA f7, TS 102ED f11 Newts: AWB 130mm, f5, Z12 f5; Cats: VMC110L, Intes MK66,VMC200L f9.75 EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker IV, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
thank you very much nFA.
love your reply. just fantastic.
I have another question.
(mods, if its not ok for me to go off topic in my own thread, please tell me, and I'll start a new thread.)
space is expanding, but not where there are gravitationally bound objects (up to Galaxy clusters).
I searched the web, and found that
our Milky Way galaxy is part of the Local Group Galaxy Cluster.
so, about 10 million light years away, there is non gravitationally bound space, and it is expanding.
could there be black holes out there?
if yes, how would the expansion of space affect them?
love your reply. just fantastic.
I have another question.
(mods, if its not ok for me to go off topic in my own thread, please tell me, and I'll start a new thread.)
space is expanding, but not where there are gravitationally bound objects (up to Galaxy clusters).
I searched the web, and found that
our Milky Way galaxy is part of the Local Group Galaxy Cluster.
so, about 10 million light years away, there is non gravitationally bound space, and it is expanding.
could there be black holes out there?
if yes, how would the expansion of space affect them?
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
All space is expanding everywhere. The fact that the local cluster has enough mass to overcome the expansion is just that. It's not that there are regions where there is no expansion. In GR space expands through and throughout the Local Cluster. It's like an ant on a balloon that is being blown up. The background balloon expands even though the ant doesn't.chasmanian wrote: ↑Mon Mar 01, 2021 4:36 am thank you very much nFA.
love your reply. just fantastic.
I have another question.
(mods, if its not ok for me to go off topic in my own thread, please tell me, and I'll start a new thread.)
space is expanding, but not where there are gravitationally bound objects (up to Galaxy clusters).
I searched the web, and found that
our Milky Way galaxy is part of the Local Group Galaxy Cluster.
so, about 10 million light years away, there is non gravitationally bound space, and it is expanding.
There could be BHs out there indeed. They wouldn't notice the expansion of space locally.An ant on a balloon would have to do some footwork to maintain a comfortable placement of its extremities. Thecould there be black holes out there?
if yes, how would the expansion of space affect them?
Remember the Hubble constant is in the neighborhood of 70 km/sec per Megaparsec IIRC. A Megaparsec is about 3.26 million light years. So the local gravity of the
Scopes: Refs: Orion ST80, SV 80EDA f7, TS 102ED f11 Newts: AWB 130mm, f5, Z12 f5; Cats: VMC110L, Intes MK66,VMC200L f9.75 EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker IV, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
thank you extra super much nFA.
so space everywhere is expanding.
the space all around me is expanding all the time. wow!!
is the human body held together by gravity?
strong enough to overcome the expansion of space?
and you doRC about the Hubble Constant:
from wiki
"Hubble constant is most frequently quoted in (km/s)/Mpc, thus giving the speed in km/s of a galaxy 1 megaparsec (3.09×1019 km) away, and its value is about 70 (km/s)/Mpc."
so space everywhere is expanding.
the space all around me is expanding all the time. wow!!
is the human body held together by gravity?
strong enough to overcome the expansion of space?
and you do
from wiki
"Hubble constant is most frequently quoted in (km/s)/Mpc, thus giving the speed in km/s of a galaxy 1 megaparsec (3.09×1019 km) away, and its value is about 70 (km/s)/Mpc."
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
The human body is held together by electromagnetic forces (chemical bonds) which are much stronger than gravity so it's not a problem. If the ant on the inflating balloon is unfortunate it might trip while it regains its footing though.chasmanian wrote: ↑Tue Mar 02, 2021 4:52 am thank you extra super much nFA.
so space everywhere is expanding.
the space all around me is expanding all the time. wow!!
is the human body held together by gravity?
strong enough to overcome the expansion of space?
when i was in school the value was closer to 100 km/s/Mpc.and you do RC about the Hubble Constant:
from wiki
"Hubble constant is most frequently quoted in (km/s)/Mpc, thus giving the speed in km/s of a galaxy 1 megaparsec (3.09×1019 km) away, and its value is about 70 (km/s)/Mpc."
Scopes: Refs: Orion ST80, SV 80EDA f7, TS 102ED f11 Newts: AWB 130mm, f5, Z12 f5; Cats: VMC110L, Intes MK66,VMC200L f9.75 EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker IV, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
thank you nFA.
I get a kick out of contemplating:
I remember you saying (I might be paraphrasing), that the edge of our observable universe is (or is like) an event horizon.
now I am thinking about how the black holes in our observable universe are places where space is unobservable.
we can only guess whats going on behind the curtains.
just like beyond the event horizon at the edge of our observable universe.
next I wondered about how many black holes there are.
here's an article from Ethan, (it looks like this is my 3rd out of 4 articles forever, not per month, bah).
https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswith ... e6cb73614e
but read this from Nasa:
"Judging from the number of stars large enough to produce such black holes, however, scientists estimate that there are as many as ten million to a billion such black holes in the Milky Way alone."
https://science.nasa.gov/astrophysics/f ... lack-holes
so perhaps there are an extremely large number of black holes in our observable universe.
an extremely large number of unobservable places in our observable universe.
dang fascinating.
I get a kick out of contemplating:
I remember you saying (I might be paraphrasing), that the edge of our observable universe is (or is like) an event horizon.
now I am thinking about how the black holes in our observable universe are places where space is unobservable.
we can only guess whats going on behind the curtains.
just like beyond the event horizon at the edge of our observable universe.
next I wondered about how many black holes there are.
here's an article from Ethan, (it looks like this is my 3rd out of 4 articles forever, not per month, bah).
https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswith ... e6cb73614e
but read this from Nasa:
"Judging from the number of stars large enough to produce such black holes, however, scientists estimate that there are as many as ten million to a billion such black holes in the Milky Way alone."
https://science.nasa.gov/astrophysics/f ... lack-holes
so perhaps there are an extremely large number of black holes in our observable universe.
an extremely large number of unobservable places in our observable universe.
dang fascinating.
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
it's like one because it IS one. an event horizon is a boundary from which no signal is possible. that's all there is to it.chasmanian wrote: ↑Wed Mar 03, 2021 4:07 am thank you nFA.
I get a kick out of contemplating:
I remember you saying (I might be paraphrasing), that the edge of our observable universe is (or is like) an event horizon.
or we could refrain from guessing.now I am thinking about how the black holes in our observable universe are places where space is unobservable.
we can only guess whats going on behind the curtains.
just like beyond the event horizon at the edge of our observable universe.
i'm pretty sure it's per month......next I wondered about how many black holes there are.
here's an article from Ethan, (it looks like this is my 3rd out of 4 articles forever, not per month, bah).
https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswith ... e6cb73614e
the NASA article has a technically misleading statement.but read this from Nasa:
"Judging from the number of stars large enough to produce such black holes, however, scientists estimate that there are as many as ten million to a billion such black holes in the Milky Way alone."
https://science.nasa.gov/astrophysics/f ... lack-holes
so perhaps there are an extremely large number of black holes in our observable universe.
an extremely large number of unobservable places in our observable universe.
dang fascinating.
You don't need matter to make aDon't let the name fool you: a black hole is anything but empty space. Rather, it is a great amount of matter packed into a very small area - think of a star ten times more massive than the Sun squeezed into a sphere approximately the diameter of New York City.
Kind of a lot of no-see-ums, yes?
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
thank you very much nFA.
good about Forbes.
"You don't need matter to make aBH . A highly curved bit of space time with NO matter will do just fine. Since gravity = spacetime curvature is energy and has a mass equivalent you can make a BH out of nothing but curved spacetime."
how would this happen?
would these be primordialBH 's?
"Kind of a lot of no-see-ums, yes?"
not sure what you mean. do you mean there are a lot ofBH 's?
good about Forbes.
"You don't need matter to make a
how would this happen?
would these be primordial
"Kind of a lot of no-see-ums, yes?"
not sure what you mean. do you mean there are a lot of
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
we couldn't make one now in the present universe but primordially? why not? BTW all the analysis done onchasmanian wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:48 am thank you very much nFA.
good about Forbes.
"You don't need matter to make a BH. A highly curved bit of space time with NO matter will do just fine. Since gravity = spacetime curvature is energy and has a mass equivalent you can make a BH out of nothing but curved spacetime."
how would this happen?
would these be primordial BH's?
i mean two things. 1) there are a lot of BHs and 2) spring is coming and no-see-um season to afflict the backyard observer."Kind of a lot of no-see-ums, yes?"
not sure what you mean. do you mean there are a lot of BH's?
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
thank you very much nFA.
wishing for you that there are not many of the biting no-see-ums this season,
or that they fall into a black hole no-see-um.
I googled about this and that. and found these. hoping they entertain you.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravastar
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_sta ... l_gravity)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark-energy_star
this is an entry about George Chapline. it has an interesting story about him and Richard Feynman. including a picture of them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Chapline_Jr.
wishing for you that there are not many of the biting no-see-ums this season,
or that they fall into a black hole no-see-um.
I googled about this and that. and found these. hoping they entertain you.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravastar
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_sta ... l_gravity)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark-energy_star
this is an entry about George Chapline. it has an interesting story about him and Richard Feynman. including a picture of them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Chapline_Jr.
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
Let me come back to this tomorrow? I'm not happy with these ideas but am late to dinner today....chasmanian wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 3:52 am thank you very much nFA.
wishing for you that there are not many of the biting no-see-ums this season,
or that they fall into a black hole no-see-um.
I googled about this and that. and found these. hoping they entertain you.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravastar
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_sta ... l_gravity)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark-energy_star
this is an entry about George Chapline. it has an interesting story about him and Richard Feynman. including a picture of them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Chapline_Jr.
Scopes: Refs: Orion ST80, SV 80EDA f7, TS 102ED f11 Newts: AWB 130mm, f5, Z12 f5; Cats: VMC110L, Intes MK66,VMC200L f9.75 EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker IV, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
The short story is that all these things are unnecessarily exotic. Not feeling well today so I need to beg off again. I wound up looking at the DAMA problems.
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
thank you very much nFA.
I hope you are feeling better soon, nFA.
I just googled DAMA problems.
got Ethan, free article number 4 for me.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswith ... 1202e15364
I hope you are feeling better soon, nFA.
I just googled DAMA problems.
got Ethan, free article number 4 for me.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswith ... 1202e15364
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
notFritzArgelander wrote: ↑Wed Mar 03, 2021 4:57 am You don't need matter to make a BH. A highly curved bit of space time with NO matter will do just fine. Since gravity = spacetime curvature is energy and has a mass equivalent you can make a BH out of nothing but curved spacetime.
Yeah but, don't mean to be contrarywise, don't you need matter (baryonic or otherwise) to curve spacetime with gravity? Possibly energy once the blackhole forms, who knows what's in a black hole! But matter required to create it in the first place?
Great thread Charlie!
Hope you feel better soon nF
Regards
Graeme
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Celestron 9.25 f10 SCT, f6.3FR, CGX mount.
ASI1600MM Pro, ASI294MC Pro, ASI224MC
ZWO EFW, ZWO OAG, ASI220MM Mini.
APM 11x70 ED APO Binoculars.
https://www.averywayobservatory.co.uk/
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
Thanks, we’re experimenting with optimizing my therapy and it’s hit and miss.Graeme1858 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 06, 2021 9:23 amnotFritzArgelander wrote: ↑Wed Mar 03, 2021 4:57 am You don't need matter to make a BH. A highly curved bit of space time with NO matter will do just fine. Since gravity = spacetime curvature is energy and has a mass equivalent you can make a BH out of nothing but curved spacetime.
Yeah but, don't mean to be contrarywise, don't you need matter (baryonic or otherwise) to curve spacetime with gravity? Possibly energy once the blackhole forms, who knows what's in a black hole! But matter required to create it in the first place?
Great thread Charlie!
Hope you feel better soon nF
Regards
Graeme
Electromagnetic fields need charges for sources because the Maxwell Equations are linear. But you don’t need matter to make a
Linear field theories need sources to make the fields. Nonlinear field theories can be their own sources. Newton's gravity was linear. Einstein's isn't.
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
They are entertaining. Reading the Wikipedia entries was amusing. For instancechasmanian wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 3:52 am thank you very much nFA.
wishing for you that there are not many of the biting no-see-ums this season,
or that they fall into a black hole no-see-um.
I googled about this and that. and found these. hoping they entertain you.
The gravastar is an amusing chimera of an idea which cobbles together several ideas from previous work.
1) dark energy
2) matter shell solutions in GR
The Wiki correctly notes that gravastars have instability problems. This is a fatal flaw. One thing that is missing from the Wiki article is that the thin shell of "perfect fluid" with p = ρ (in units where c = 1 otherwise p = ρc^2) is a very strange kind of matter. It's matter where the speed of sound equal the speed of light! So the "matter shell" is made of unobtanium. The limit on the speed of sound is one third of the speed of light. A gas of massless particles can only reach a sound speed of one third the speed of light. So with this material right at the edge violating causality and having a sound speed that is higher than any possible matter, it's no wonder the object is unstable being composed of unobtainium.
The Black Star is a more legitimate idea. In Einstein-Cartan-Sciama-Kibble gravity is might even be required! In the past when I have spoken of BHs in ECSK gravity it is perhaps a little loose since the Black Star idea is exactly what an ECSK "black hole" looks like. The addition of torsion in spacetime coupled to particle spins produces a repulsive force that prevents collapse to a singularity. There are ongoing debates about the stability of such objects but it's hard......
The ECSK literature doesn't use the term "Black Star" though. For instance this work envisions massive neutron stars as the result.
https://arxiv.org/abs/2012.01131
In this project, we try to find the correlation between the non-local pressure inside the massive neutron stars resisting the gravitational collapse of the core and ECSK dark energy led by the effect of spin-torsion coupling between quark fields and the space-time at very high densities much larger than the nuclear density. The injection of dark energy into the core of massive neutron stars (MANs) and extra resistant nature of this dark energy to the collapse of MANs by the anti-gravity give the possibility of existence of neutron stars in the unobserved mass range of [2.16M⊙,5M⊙]. Obtaining the ECSK TOV equation gives the local pressure of the ambient medium of MANs. Moreover, the negative pressure from the ECSK dark energy is obtained from the Lagrangian again, from which we are able to investigate the hydro-static equilibrium of the core and ambient medium of the MANs. If the equilibrium state is satisfied for the unobserved mass gap for the MANs in ECSK theory framework this will imply our model predicts this vast mass range of unobserved spectrum of the MANs in astrophysical studies.
This idea is more plausible than Gravastars but less interesting than Black Stars, The missing element here is a way of converting infalling matter into Dark Energy. That is unknown physics not self contradictory physics.
He's a clever fellow.this is an entry about George Chapline. it has an interesting story about him and Richard Feynman. including a picture of them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Chapline_Jr.
Scopes: Refs: Orion ST80, SV 80EDA f7, TS 102ED f11 Newts: AWB 130mm, f5, Z12 f5; Cats: VMC110L, Intes MK66,VMC200L f9.75 EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker IV, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
thank you very much Graeme.
thank you nFA for your very interesting thoughts about all of this.
utterly fascinating.
is it possible that all of the Black Holes in the Universe,
are actually Black Stars?
thank you nFA for your very interesting thoughts about all of this.
utterly fascinating.
is it possible that all of the Black Holes in the Universe,
are actually Black Stars?
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Re: anti Dark Matter?
let's step away from the specifics of theories that make Dark Stars to a more general consideration. the main question is whether whatever theory predicts that the surface of the Black Star is at or outside the event horizon?chasmanian wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 4:33 am
is it possible that all of the Black Holes in the Universe,
are actually Black Stars?
if the theory gives results that indicate a Black Star surface is larger than the equivalent mass event horizon then the answer is definitely no. LIGO/Virgo see clean signals from
Now what if the theory predicts that the object collapses into an event horizon? Then all bets are off and all BHs could be Black Stars. LIGO\Virgo might not be able to tell....
The ECSK paper I linked above that had fat neutron stars is not the only way ECSK could yield a Black Star. It's possible that the torsion spin fluid could stop collapse only after densities get much closer to the Planck density, for instance.
Scopes: Refs: Orion ST80, SV 80EDA f7, TS 102ED f11 Newts: AWB 130mm, f5, Z12 f5; Cats: VMC110L, Intes MK66,VMC200L f9.75 EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker IV, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5
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