Half a century after Apollo, why haven’t we been back to the Moon?

[smp]

From Are Technica:

"The 50th anniversary of NASA’s historic landing on the Moon—this Saturday, July 20th—provokes a decidedly bittersweet feeling. Certainly, this marks an appropriate time to pause and celebrate a singular moment in our shared history, the first time humans ever set foot on another world. Neil Armstrong, Buzz Aldrin, and Michael Collins really did push back the frontier for all of humanity

And yet, for all that this technological and geopolitical tour de force achieved, there has been a decided lack of follow through by the US spaceflight enterprise since Apollo 11. On such an anniversary, this raises uncomfortable questions. Why have we not gone back? Was the Apollo Program really America’s high water mark in space? And will we actually return in the next half century?"

https://arstechnica.com/science/2019/07 ... -the-moon/

This was a nice read, but I did not learn anything new.

smp

[helicon]

Agreed. Nothing really new. But I'm hopeful for the next twenty years or so. If we're celebrating the 75th anniversary of Apollo 11 without a trip to Mars in there it will be very disappointing.

[helicon]

Another thought:

I do hope that we can do something about going to Mars in the next 25 years or so. It would be a shame if we reach the 75th anniversary of Apollo 11 without going to Mars (going to the moon again is a bit gratuitous). If you think about it, we have made so many strides in the technological world since then (PC's, Internet, social networks, search engines, mobile phones) it's weird that mankind has kind of regressed when it comes to manned exploration of the solar system. Maybe Elon Musk will get his wish of "dying on Mars" as he has tweeted before.

[Richard]

I suppose its all about money , there is no incentive as before that west was better than the Russians , if the world was all one I am sure it would be different

[notFritzArgelander]

I suppose its all about money , there is no incentive as before that west was better than the Russians , if the world was all one I am sure it would be different

I have a different take on "it's all about money". The world's disposable income maxed out in the middle third of the 20th century. It's been declining ever since. Technological advances have not kept pace with world economic decline. This is especially true for key technologies involving lift to orbit. It would need private rocketeers to beat their most optimistic projections of lift cost reduction for grand explorations to become feasible again.

My fear is we've missed the boat.

[notFritzArgelander]

That's my bad news. There is a good news side in that there is sufficient waste in the current economic system to make exploration affordable again. I don't know how to easily write about that without touching on politics. However I can briefly hint that the abandonment of moderately regulated market capitalism in favor of cartels that combine government and private interests into blocks has not been wholesome. Think of Eisenhower's farewell address to the nation as he left office.

I hope to not have transgressed with that. Can we leave that bit of it there?

[avid.astronomer]

[notFritzArgelander]

227784.png

Exactly! Can't take those hoo-mans anywhere.

[AntennaGuy]

Can we have a little more optimism please?

The future isn't over yet. Thanks.

[notFritzArgelander]

Can we have a little more optimism please?

The future isn't over yet. Thanks.

No. The existing trends leave no basis for optimism. Being optimistic about the oncoming Mack truck will not avoid a collision. Corrective action is required.

Blind faith is impotent. Only a realistic assessment does diddly. Faith rooted in reality works.

[AntennaGuy]

Blind faith is impotent. Only a realistic assessment does diddly. Faith rooted in reality works.

Hmm. Reminds me of this rooted-in-reality assessment:
https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/08371d96-8 ... 783be9f9fa
and this
https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/b433a507-4 ... ffe1ce2def
Per Darth Vader (a minister of the Church of the Force), a little faith may be appropriate sometimes. It's not always blind. For more perspective,
https://www.desiderata.com/desiderata.html

p.s. There are a LOT of videos of pithy movie quotes out there -- pray that I do not unleash them all.

[notFritzArgelander]

Blind faith is impotent. Only a realistic assessment does diddly. Faith rooted in reality works.

Hmm. Reminds me of this rooted-in-reality assessment:
https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/08371d96-8 ... 783be9f9fa
and this
https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/b433a507-4 ... ffe1ce2def
Per Darth Vader (a minister of the Church of the Force), a little faith may be appropriate sometimes. It's not always blind. For more perspective,
https://www.desiderata.com/desiderata.html

p.s. There are a LOT of videos of pithy movie quotes out there -- pray that I do not unleash them all.

Unleash all the pithy videos you like! Mere rhetoric does not constitute valid argument.

As for "desiderata" it's nice but hardly a point in favor of optimism. It's more balanced than mere "optimism".

As far as "faith" itself is concerned folks often misunderstand it as "ignore the data" thus committing Parmenides's Original Intellectual Sin over and over again. It's especially prevalent today when prominent figures depart so far from facts but still have the blind uncritical faith of their sheep like flock.

In any case faith without reason is unbalanced, unhinged and unhealthy. I think that balance between the too is essential so I am pretty well immune to criticism of "lack of faith". It's a baseless criticism.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faith_and_rationality

What we lack in our leadership is precisely that balance between faith and reason that Cnut the Great showed:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_Canute_and_the_tide

Yeah... It's an apocryphal story but it's certainly it's just as a propos as a sci fi meme?

Anyway the point is that without fact based, rational, leadership nothing positive can be done. For a fine example of what happens when you rely on faith without balancing reason check out the Romanoffs.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Execution ... nov_family

Faith without reason ends badly. Wishing the Mack truck away will not keep it from flattening you.

[notFritzArgelander]

If I may be permitted a personal note of family pride, an uncle (now passed) was a guidance system designer and worked on the Saturn V.

[AntennaGuy]

If I may be permitted a personal note of family pride, an uncle (now passed) was a guidance system designer and worked on the Saturn V.

And indeed you should be proud of him. My father (also deceased) designed power systems for spacecraft in the 60s'-70s. His work inspired my pursuit of science. It may be unlikely, but it is not inconceivable that your uncle and my father may have met or even worked together at some time. Either way, they contributed to advancing the space program. And we honor their memory by inspiring the next generation(s).

Clear skies.

[notFritzArgelander]

If I may be permitted a personal note of family pride, an uncle (now passed) was a guidance system designer and worked on the Saturn V.

And indeed you should be proud of him. My father (also deceased) designed power systems for spacecraft in the 60s'-70s. His work inspired my pursuit of science. It may be unlikely, but it is not inconceivable that your uncle and my father may have met or even worked together at some time. Either way, they contributed to advancing the space program. And we honor their memory by inspiring the next generation(s).

It would be more likely they met if they both worked for Boeing or at MSFC.

Ironically, it's from this uncle and that side of the family that I got into music, board games and Japanese cultural appreciation. (Long story.) The other side of the family was more directly influential with regard to science. They are the source of the telescopes, optics kits, and chemistry sets. There was a complete electronics workshop in the basement where I could geek out over dad's oscilloscope. I had an inordinate fondness for Lissajous figures before I could do algebra...... Mom's main contribution to my corruption / education was an early introduction to Socrates and logic.

Both sides contributed to appreciating minority views since they were religious minorities who fled to the NA British colonies.