Amount of information in visible universe quantified

[notFritzArgelander]

In previous studies, Vopson postulated information is a fifth state of matter alongside solid, liquid, gas, and plasma, and that elusive dark matter could be information.

https://phys.org/news/2021-10-amount-vi ... ified.html

[helicon]

Very interesting article. Information as the elusive dark matter?
I would bring up the "ether" from days of yore...but

[notFritzArgelander]

Very interesting article. Information as the elusive dark matter?
I would bring up the "ether" from days of yore...but

I think that there’s an older thread on that topic. I’ll look for it once I get back home.

[turboscrew]

This takes a while to sink in...

[notFritzArgelander]

I can't find the "older thread" about how information might have mass. There is a bookmark to it on my tablet but perhaps I forgot to post it? Anyway here goes.....

https://bigthink.com/hard-science/dark-matter-theory/

[notFritzArgelander]

This takes a while to sink in...

It's either a very deep insight or utter foolishness. Time will tell. I'm not placing any bets.

[Michael131313]

Thanks nFA. In this case what is the definition of "information "?

[notFritzArgelander]

Thanks nFA. In this case what is the definition of "information "?

For a given particle, how many bits are needed to encode particle properties. It's very interesting you ask that. The paper is found here.

https://aip.scitation.org/doi/full/10.1063/5.0064475

The information capacity of the universe has been a topic of great debate since the 1970s and continues to stimulate multiple branches of physics research. Here, we used Shannon’s information theory to estimate the amount of encoded information in all the visible matter in the universe. We achieved this by deriving a detailed formula estimating the total number of particles in the observable universe, known as the Eddington number, and by estimating the amount of information stored by each particle about itself. We determined that each particle in the observable universe contains 1.509 bits of information and there are ∼6 × 10^80 bits of information stored in all the matter particles of the observable universe.

Without getting too much into the technical details I find the statement that each particle has on average 1.509 bits of information to be odd. Well, more than odd. I think it makes no sense. Just to specify the charges (including EM, weak and strung nuclear forces) on a single takes several bits per particle. I think his method of estimation from starting with the entropy of the universe viewed as a black hole and working down from that is backwards. Starting from the ground up many bits are required to specify which particle you have.

[Michael131313]

Thanks again nFA. I don't understand how a particle could have bits encoded in, on or around it and have mass that has not been detected. Would it be an "information field ".

[notFritzArgelander]

Thanks again nFA. I don't understand how a particle could have bits encoded in, on or around it and have mass that has not been detected. Would it be an "information field ".

I think something like that is the underlying idea. There isn't a complete theory, just a working hypothesis.

As to what a complete theory would look like..... it would probably look something like a relativistic version of MOND. :shrug:

[Michael131313]

Oh no! Not another MOND type theory . Thanks nFA.

[notFritzArgelander]

Oh no! Not another MOND type theory . Thanks nFA.

It's awful, but not as awful as I might have thought yesterday. Did you see this thread? viewtopic.php?f=74&t=21306

It looks like MONDophiles are finally getting off their lazy behinds and dealing with the cosmological failures of MOND with some success. Not enough to make be love it. Just enough to get it under condition of less than maximum distaste.