Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

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Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#1

Post by bobharmony »


In my search to reduce noise in my stacked images, I have been working with Stuart to produce flats that average out at half the maximum ADU value of the Canon 60D. Up to this point I have been using the AV function of the camera to determine the flats exposure. When I used the AP Lab program to measure those flats, they showed an average ADU of about 2K, much less than the 15.3K maximum ADU reported by APLab. By reducing the brightness setting on my light panel and adding a sheet of white paper between the panel and the scope opening, I was able to get the average ADU up to 7.6K with a 1/20" exposure.

I then stacked the image with the new flats using DSS, then processed the image in StarTools and compared it to my results with the original AV flats, and have reported on the differences in the thread I started on flats troubles back in October. That thread includes images of the AV flats result, and the brighter new set of flats, along with my observations on the differences. That report can be found here: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=3914&start=60#p42263

To bring out a bit more of the dark nebulosity, I loaded the finished ST image into PhotoShop and did a bit of levels and contrast adjustments to produce the image I post here. It is the best version to my eye that I have managed yet. Comments and questions are welcome!
Iris KS 1-20 flats ST PS.jpg
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Hardware: Celestron C6-N w/ Advanced GTmount, Baader MK iii CC, Orion ST-80, Canon 60D (unmodded), Nikon D5300 (modded), Orion SSAG
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#2

Post by Baskevo »


That is awesome Bob! I'm happy you were able to get the flats working! It's a pain in the butt but it is definitely worth it! Stuart is very helpful with flats :)
It looks really great!
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#3

Post by JayTee »


Bob,

What image acquisition program were you using to take the original (AV setting) flats?

JT
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#4

Post by yobbo89 »


very good bob!
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#5

Post by Juno16 »


Great repro Bob! You have really shaped up a fine image!

I wasn’t sure how you measured the flats though. Did you use AP Lab? I like AP Lab, but will try the APT flats wizard too.

Again, fine work! Do you feel that the flats quality was mostly responsible for the better image or was it all factors combined?

Thanks,
Jim
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#6

Post by Hankmeister3 »


I'm lost with respect to the technical details and the remedy, however I do know this is a beautiful and captivating image. Thanks for sharing your updated image, Bob.
Telescopes: Meade LX90 10-inch f/10 UHC Coma-free SCT; Explore Scientific 127mm f/7.5 APO ED triplet refractor; Explore Scientific 102mm f/7 APO ED triplet refractor; Explore Scientific 80mm f/6 APO ED triplet refractor; Skywatcher 72mm f/6 ED Schott doublet refractor; Meade 70mm f/5 APO quadruplet astrograph refractor; Skywatcher Quattro 8-inch f/4 Newtonian astrograph; Orion 6-inch f/4 Newtonian astrograph; Skywatcher SkyMax 180mm f/15 Maksutov; iOptron 150mm f/12 Maksutov; Orion f/9 Ritchey-Chretien RC astrograph
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#7

Post by bobharmony »


JayTee wrote: Sun Dec 01, 2019 6:23 am Bob,

What image acquisition program were you using to take the original (AV setting) flats?

JT
JT - I have been using BackyardEOS for flats as long as I have been collecting calibration frames. The camera does the work in that scenario, as the camera gets set to the AV position, and BYEOS just goes along for the ride. The BYEOS histogram looks good when the flats are taken, but measurement with AP Lab tells a different story. I think BYEOS applies a temporary stretch to the displayed flat image for display purposes, and bases the histogram on the stretched image.

The latest flats were taken using APT, and I controlled the exposure time manually, then measured the flats with the AP Lab program. I would have done the same thing with BYEOS, but am looking to migrate to APT, so went that route for the latest flats. The APT histogram peaks all the way to the right, but AP Lab reports the actual saturation level.

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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#8

Post by bobharmony »


Juno16 wrote: Sun Dec 01, 2019 11:52 am Great repro Bob! You have really shaped up a fine image!

I wasn’t sure how you measured the flats though. Did you use AP Lab? I like AP Lab, but will try the APT flats wizard too.

Again, fine work! Do you feel that the flats quality was mostly responsible for the better image or was it all factors combined?

Thanks,
Jim
Jim - I used AP Lab to analyze the flats for ADU levels. I have read about the APT flats wizard, my impression is that it is intended for dedicated astro cams, not for DSLRs. Thanks for the nice comments.

I went into detail of the two images in the thread linked in my original post. In short, I processed both images in StarTools using the same process flow, and got more detail and better color from the new flats, so I would give them a lot of credit for the improvement. Both StarTools results are shown in that thread, but I will put them here too.

New flats process:
Iris KS 1-20 flats ST.jpg
AV flats process:
Iris KS AV flats ST.jpg
Bob
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

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Post by Juno16 »


bobharmony wrote: Sun Dec 01, 2019 2:05 pm
Jim - I used AP Lab to analyze the flats for ADU levels. I have read about the APT flats wizard, my impression is that it is intended for dedicated astro cams, not for DSLRs. Thanks for the nice comments.

I went into detail of the two images in the thread linked in my original post. In short, I processed both images in StarTools using the same process flow, and got more detail and better color from the new flats, so I would give them a lot of credit for the improvement. Both StarTools results are shown in that thread, but I will put them here too.

Bob
That really is amazing improvement Bob!

AP Lab is easy enough to use. My mid peak histogram flats read a very low adu in AP Lab. I will give it a try for sure.

Amazing difference!

Thanks,
Jim
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

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Post by JayTee »


Both BYE and APT use the AV setting to take the flats. The reason I asked was that if you did use APT to acquire your flats on the AV setting, given the results that you got from AP Lab I wonder if you should drop Ivo an email telling him your exploits. Ivo may then be able to explain how APT determines the settings for the histogram for the flats and/or he may be able to make an adjustment in the way APT takes the flats based on your findings and research.

Cheers,
JT
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#11

Post by Baskevo »


JayTee wrote: Sun Dec 01, 2019 8:59 pm Both BYE and APT use the AV setting to take the flats. The reason I asked was that if you did use APT to acquire your flats on the AV setting, given the results that you got from AP Lab I wonder if you should drop Ivo an email telling him your exploits. Ivo may then be able to explain how APT determines the settings for the histogram for the flats and/or he may be able to make an adjustment in the way APT takes the flats based on your findings and research.

Cheers,
JT
This sounds like a good idea to me! I think I will do that!
-James W.

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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#12

Post by STEVE333 »


Wonderful improvement Bob.

It's taken me a long time to figure out how to take good flats with my DSLR. I use BYEOS to capture my Flats, but, I use Pixinsight to measure the results and then adjust the exposure time in BYEOS to get the proper Flats exposure time.

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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

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Post by MariusD69 »


Wonderful! Great work, Bob!
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

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Post by ic_1101 »


Big improvement Bob, beautiful image!
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#15

Post by JohnP_1 »


Well done Bob! Nice reprocess.
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#16

Post by fatboy1271 »


Looks great Bob!

APLab is my Flats savior!!! It was such a struggle trying to find out if I had half ADU until using APLab and poor [mention]Stuart[/mention] had to read my same issues over and over when I was fighting with PI readings on ADU :)
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Re: Iris Nebula - reprocess w/ new flats - round 2

#17

Post by bobharmony »


fatboy1271 wrote: Wed Dec 04, 2019 9:03 pm Looks great Bob!

APLab is my Flats savior!!! It was such a struggle trying to find out if I had half ADU until using APLab and poor @Stuart had to read my same issues over and over when I was fighting with PI readings on ADU :)
Agreed, APLabs is a great tool for this (and I am so happy that Stu has been so patient with a bunch of us )!

Bob
Hardware: Celestron C6-N w/ Advanced GTmount, Baader MK iii CC, Orion ST-80, Canon 60D (unmodded), Nikon D5300 (modded), Orion SSAG
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