Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

Post your DSO images here.
Post Reply
User avatar
Juno16 United States of America
Universal Ambassador
Articles: 0
Offline
Posts: 8195
Joined: Sun May 12, 2019 3:13 pm
4
Location: Mississippi Gulf Coast
Status:
Offline

TSS Awards Badges

TSS Photo of the Day

Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#1

Post by Juno16 »


Just a follow up on the thread NGC 6960 on Steriods viewtopic.php?p=170861#p170861

I reprocessed the Pickering Triangle data (including NGC 6960) using drizzle integration in Pixinsight. Also, a much lighter hand on the image process as a whole. Not much star reduction and little if any modification to color saturation or balance.

Just two different looks to the image. The “Steriod” version is very bold and is appealing in some ways. In fact, I believe that this is the version that I will have a print made from.

The version here is much more subtle and softer. All of the details are there, just not so bold.

As far as drizzle goes, it really is an amazing improvement on the star quality. With this scope/camera, I am shooting with a pixel scale of 2.8 arcsec/pixel.

However, drizzling does come with a price. Lots more processing time and much larger files.

For instance, my 2 year old Ryzen 7 2700x 8 core cpu with 32G DDR4 ram chewed on the 651 light frames of M31 for a total of 5 hours today to produce the integrated drizzled file.

Lots of fun to learn the process though and I will definitely be using it again.

Original “Steriod” version.

9-15-3ps sm.jpg

Here is the reprocessed with drizzle and much lighter hand.

Pickering's Triangle Final bl drop rgb copy.jpg

Lots of folks responded that they liked the NGC 6960 on Steriods thread which kind of surprised me some. It is really bold and saturated, but kind of cool too.

Let me know what you think!

Thanks for looking!
Jim

Scopes: Explore Scientific ED102 APO, Sharpstar 61 EDPH II APO, Samyang 135 F2 (still on the Nikon).
Mount: Skywatcher HEQ5 Pro with Rowan Belt Mod
Stuff: ASI EAF Focus Motor (x2), Orion 50mm Guide Scope, ZWO 30 mm Guide Scope, ASI 220mm min, ASI 120mm mini, Stellarview 0.8 FR/FF, Sharpstar 0.8 FR/FF, Mele Overloock 3C.
Camera/Filters/Software: ASI 533 mc pro, ASI 120mm mini, Orion SSAG, IDAS LPS D-1, Optolong L-Enhance, ZWO UV/IR Cut, N.I.N.A., Green Swamp Server, PHD2, Adobe Photoshop CC, Pixinsight.
Dog and best bud: Jack
Sky: Bortle 6-7
My Astrobin: https://www.astrobin.com/users/Juno16/
User avatar
AstroBee United States of America
Moderator
Moderator
Articles: 0
Online
Posts: 2200
Joined: Thu Nov 14, 2019 11:03 pm
4
Location: Henderson, NV
Status:
Online

TSS Awards Badges

TSS Photo of the Day

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#2

Post by AstroBee »


I prefer the Original “Steriod” version myself.
Greg M.~ "Ad Astra per Aspera"
Scopes: Celestron EdgeHD14", Explore Scientific ED152CF & ED127 APO's, StellarVue SV70T, Classic Orange-Tube C-8, Lunt 80mm Ha double-stack solar scope.
Mounts: Astro-Physics Mach One, iOptron CEM70EC Mount, iOptron ZEQ25 Mount.
Cameras: ZWO ASI2600mm Pro, ZWO 2600MC Pro, ZWO ASI1600mm
Filters: 36mm Chroma LRGB & 3nm Ha, OIII, SII, L-Pro, L-eXtreme
Eyepieces: 27mm TeleVue Panoptic, 4mm TeleVue Radian, Explore Scientific 82° 30mm, 6.7mm , Baader 13mm Hyperion, Explore Scientific 70° 10mm, 15mm, 20mm, Meade 8.8mm UWA
Software: N.I.N.A., SharpCapPro, PixInsight, PhotoShop CC, Phd2, Stellarium
https://www.nevadadesertskies.com
User avatar
Juno16 United States of America
Universal Ambassador
Articles: 0
Offline
Posts: 8195
Joined: Sun May 12, 2019 3:13 pm
4
Location: Mississippi Gulf Coast
Status:
Offline

TSS Awards Badges

TSS Photo of the Day

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#3

Post by Juno16 »


AstroBee wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 2:55 am I prefer the Original “Steriod” version myself.
Thanks AB!

I am definitely interested in what folks like. I had a lot of fun with the steriod version and also with the drizzle version (neat learnings). The steriod version for sure would be a better candidate for printing. I think that drizzling and a more bold process would be the best option.

This is a zoom of what drizzling does for the stars when undersampled (probably classic).
Drizzle vs non Drizzle.JPG
I just thought that the more subtle process looks more "natural", but I can't tell you what natural looks like as I only have lp views and really, they are visually not very impressive.

Thanks for your comment!
Jim

Scopes: Explore Scientific ED102 APO, Sharpstar 61 EDPH II APO, Samyang 135 F2 (still on the Nikon).
Mount: Skywatcher HEQ5 Pro with Rowan Belt Mod
Stuff: ASI EAF Focus Motor (x2), Orion 50mm Guide Scope, ZWO 30 mm Guide Scope, ASI 220mm min, ASI 120mm mini, Stellarview 0.8 FR/FF, Sharpstar 0.8 FR/FF, Mele Overloock 3C.
Camera/Filters/Software: ASI 533 mc pro, ASI 120mm mini, Orion SSAG, IDAS LPS D-1, Optolong L-Enhance, ZWO UV/IR Cut, N.I.N.A., Green Swamp Server, PHD2, Adobe Photoshop CC, Pixinsight.
Dog and best bud: Jack
Sky: Bortle 6-7
My Astrobin: https://www.astrobin.com/users/Juno16/
User avatar
AstroBee United States of America
Moderator
Moderator
Articles: 0
Online
Posts: 2200
Joined: Thu Nov 14, 2019 11:03 pm
4
Location: Henderson, NV
Status:
Online

TSS Awards Badges

TSS Photo of the Day

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#4

Post by AstroBee »


I think the best of both worlds would be to drizzle to get those nice round, smooth stars but then process on steroids.
Again, just my opinion.
Greg M.~ "Ad Astra per Aspera"
Scopes: Celestron EdgeHD14", Explore Scientific ED152CF & ED127 APO's, StellarVue SV70T, Classic Orange-Tube C-8, Lunt 80mm Ha double-stack solar scope.
Mounts: Astro-Physics Mach One, iOptron CEM70EC Mount, iOptron ZEQ25 Mount.
Cameras: ZWO ASI2600mm Pro, ZWO 2600MC Pro, ZWO ASI1600mm
Filters: 36mm Chroma LRGB & 3nm Ha, OIII, SII, L-Pro, L-eXtreme
Eyepieces: 27mm TeleVue Panoptic, 4mm TeleVue Radian, Explore Scientific 82° 30mm, 6.7mm , Baader 13mm Hyperion, Explore Scientific 70° 10mm, 15mm, 20mm, Meade 8.8mm UWA
Software: N.I.N.A., SharpCapPro, PixInsight, PhotoShop CC, Phd2, Stellarium
https://www.nevadadesertskies.com
User avatar
bobharmony
Local Group Ambassador
Articles: 0
Offline
Posts: 2028
Joined: Sun May 12, 2019 1:11 pm
4
Location: Connecticut, US
Status:
Offline

TSS Photo of the Day

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#5

Post by bobharmony »


The drizzle certainly makes the stars look cleaner! I'm amazed that so few stars show up in both versions, did you do something specific to control them? That is some fine data.

Bob
Hardware: Celestron C6-N w/ Advanced GTmount, Baader MK iii CC, Orion ST-80, Canon 60D (unmodded), Nikon D5300 (modded), Orion SSAG
Software: BYE, APT, PHD2, DSS, PhotoShop CC 2020, StarTools, Cartes du Ciel, AstroTortilla

Image
User avatar
Juno16 United States of America
Universal Ambassador
Articles: 0
Offline
Posts: 8195
Joined: Sun May 12, 2019 3:13 pm
4
Location: Mississippi Gulf Coast
Status:
Offline

TSS Awards Badges

TSS Photo of the Day

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#6

Post by Juno16 »


AstroBee wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 3:05 am I think the best of both worlds would be to drizzle to get those nice round, smooth stars but then process on steroids.
Again, just my opinion.
I definitely appreciate your opinion and thanks for sharing it!

I agree. The time investment in drizzling is worth it. Actually, it took me much less time to post-process the steriod version. It seems harder to get things just right with a soft approach. Thanks AB!

bobharmony wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 3:08 am The drizzle certainly makes the stars look cleaner! I'm amazed that so few stars show up in both versions, did you do something specific to control them? That is some fine data.

Bob
Thanks Bob! Yes, the starfield is really dense. I did separate the stars with Starnett++, but only did a contrast enhancement on the stars. I used a process gingerly in Pixinsight called Morphological Transformation that does quite a nice quick job of reducing the star field quickly and easily.
The data was limited to about 4.5 hours, but it was fun. Yes, drizzling is really amazing!

I am very fortunate to be out again tonight imaging the Elephants Trunk (first time) with the L-eNhance filter and the Sharpstar 61. The moon is at 90% so I will take what I can. It will go into the trees about 2 a.m. and I will switch to the Heart. I should be able to frame the entire Heart with the Sharpstar 61.

Thanks Bob!
Jim

Scopes: Explore Scientific ED102 APO, Sharpstar 61 EDPH II APO, Samyang 135 F2 (still on the Nikon).
Mount: Skywatcher HEQ5 Pro with Rowan Belt Mod
Stuff: ASI EAF Focus Motor (x2), Orion 50mm Guide Scope, ZWO 30 mm Guide Scope, ASI 220mm min, ASI 120mm mini, Stellarview 0.8 FR/FF, Sharpstar 0.8 FR/FF, Mele Overloock 3C.
Camera/Filters/Software: ASI 533 mc pro, ASI 120mm mini, Orion SSAG, IDAS LPS D-1, Optolong L-Enhance, ZWO UV/IR Cut, N.I.N.A., Green Swamp Server, PHD2, Adobe Photoshop CC, Pixinsight.
Dog and best bud: Jack
Sky: Bortle 6-7
My Astrobin: https://www.astrobin.com/users/Juno16/
User avatar
Jockinireland Ireland
Milky Way Ambassador
Articles: 0
Online
Posts: 1920
Joined: Sat Aug 24, 2019 7:56 pm
4
Location: Galway
Status:
Online

TSS Photo of the Day

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#7

Post by Jockinireland »


Hi Jim, the drizzle certainly make a difference alright. I'm with the others though in that overall I prefer the first version. Great you are getting out. Wall to wall clouds here again for the foreseeable>
Scope: Skywatcher Evostar 80ED (SW 0.85 FR/FF) on a SW NEQ6Pro
Guiding; SW Evoguide 50ED, ASI 120mm mini
Meade 8" LX200 GPS on wedge (Guided with a cheapo 50mm guidescope and a ZWO ASI 120mm mini)
Sharpstar 61EDPH II (with dedicated 0.8 reducer) with wiliam Optics 32mm uniguide
Camera: ASI2600MC pro. QHY 163M with ZWO 7nm NB filters, Canon EOS700D astro mod
Secondary mount: Skywatcher StarAdventurer

My Astrobin https://www.astrobin.com/users/mackiedlm/
User avatar
Juno16 United States of America
Universal Ambassador
Articles: 0
Offline
Posts: 8195
Joined: Sun May 12, 2019 3:13 pm
4
Location: Mississippi Gulf Coast
Status:
Offline

TSS Awards Badges

TSS Photo of the Day

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#8

Post by Juno16 »


Jockinireland wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 12:08 pm Hi Jim, the drizzle certainly make a difference alright. I'm with the others though in that overall I prefer the first version. Great you are getting out. Wall to wall clouds here again for the foreseeable>
Thanks David.

Actually, I like the first version better too. I will probably be drizzling with this scope every process. So much to learn with PI.
I’m taking Adam Block’s Fundamentals and enjoying it a lot.

Sorry about clouds! I’m fortunate here to have a few clear days/nights ahead since a cool front passed through.

Got some time on both IC1396 and IC 1305 last night and plan to do the same tonight.
The moon is a blasting, but the L-eNhance helps out a good bit.

I appreciate your reply sir! Best of success with the skies!
Jim

Scopes: Explore Scientific ED102 APO, Sharpstar 61 EDPH II APO, Samyang 135 F2 (still on the Nikon).
Mount: Skywatcher HEQ5 Pro with Rowan Belt Mod
Stuff: ASI EAF Focus Motor (x2), Orion 50mm Guide Scope, ZWO 30 mm Guide Scope, ASI 220mm min, ASI 120mm mini, Stellarview 0.8 FR/FF, Sharpstar 0.8 FR/FF, Mele Overloock 3C.
Camera/Filters/Software: ASI 533 mc pro, ASI 120mm mini, Orion SSAG, IDAS LPS D-1, Optolong L-Enhance, ZWO UV/IR Cut, N.I.N.A., Green Swamp Server, PHD2, Adobe Photoshop CC, Pixinsight.
Dog and best bud: Jack
Sky: Bortle 6-7
My Astrobin: https://www.astrobin.com/users/Juno16/
User avatar
JayTee United States of America
Universal Ambassador
Articles: 2
Online
Posts: 5619
Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2019 3:23 am
4
Location: Idaho, USA
Status:
Online

TSS Awards Badges

TSS Photo of the Day

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#9

Post by JayTee »


Hi Jim,

This is interesting. I think your two examples show that there is a border line between what is accurate and what is art. The steroid version is certainly more artistic than the more "accurate" version. I think that may be why folks respond to it so well, myself included.

Cheers
∞ Primary Scopes: #1: Celestron CPC1100 #2: 8" f/7.5 Dob #3: CR150HD f/8 6" frac
∞ AP Scopes: #1: TPO 6" f/9 RC #2: ES 102 f/7 APO #3: ES 80mm f/6 APO
∞ G&G Scopes: #1: Meade 102mm f/7.8 #2: Bresser 102mm f/4.5
∞ Guide Scopes: 70 & 80mm fracs -- The El Cheapo Bros.
∞ Mounts: iOptron CEM70AG, SW EQ6, Celestron AVX, SLT & GT (Alt-Az), Meade DS2000
∞ Cameras: #1: ZWO ASI294MC Pro #2: 662MC #3: 120MC, Canon T3i, Orion SSAG, WYZE Cam3
∞ Binos: 10X50,11X70,15X70, 25X100
∞ EPs: ES 2": 21mm 100° & 30mm 82° Pentax XW: 7, 10, 14, & 20mm 70°

Searching the skies since 1966. "I never met a scope I didn't want to keep."

Image
User avatar
messier 111 Canada
Universal Ambassador
Articles: 0
Offline
Posts: 9472
Joined: Mon Nov 09, 2020 2:49 am
3
Location: Canada's capital region .
Status:
Offline

TSS Awards Badges

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#10

Post by messier 111 »


AstroBee wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 2:55 am I prefer the Original “Steriod” version myself.
+1
I LOVE REFRACTORS , :Astronomer1: :sprefac:

REFRACTOR , TS-Optics Doublet SD-APO 125 mm f/7.8 . Lunt 80mm MT Ha Doublet Refractor .

EYEPIECES, Delos , Delite and 26mm Nagler t5 , 2 zoom Svbony 7-21 , Orion Premium Linear BinoViewer .

FILTER , Nebustar 2 tele vue . Apm solar wedge . contrast booster 2 inches .

Mounts , berno mack 3 with telepod , cg-4 motorized , eq6 pro belt drive .

“Your assumptions are your windows on the world. Scrub them off every once in a while, or the light won't come in.”
― Isaac Asimov

Jean-Yves :flags-canada:
User avatar
Juno16 United States of America
Universal Ambassador
Articles: 0
Offline
Posts: 8195
Joined: Sun May 12, 2019 3:13 pm
4
Location: Mississippi Gulf Coast
Status:
Offline

TSS Awards Badges

TSS Photo of the Day

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#11

Post by Juno16 »


JayTee wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 6:54 pm Hi Jim,

This is interesting. I think your two examples show that there is a border line between what is accurate and what is art. The steroid version is certainly more artistic than the more "accurate" version. I think that maybe why folks respond to it so well, myself included.

Cheers
I agree JT. Even the steriod version is somewhat accurate, just maybe "exaggerated". The more accurate version is boring!

Me too, I also favor the steriod version. Perhaps when I get around to it, I will re-process the steriod version with drizzle.

Good learnings!

Thanks!
Jim

Scopes: Explore Scientific ED102 APO, Sharpstar 61 EDPH II APO, Samyang 135 F2 (still on the Nikon).
Mount: Skywatcher HEQ5 Pro with Rowan Belt Mod
Stuff: ASI EAF Focus Motor (x2), Orion 50mm Guide Scope, ZWO 30 mm Guide Scope, ASI 220mm min, ASI 120mm mini, Stellarview 0.8 FR/FF, Sharpstar 0.8 FR/FF, Mele Overloock 3C.
Camera/Filters/Software: ASI 533 mc pro, ASI 120mm mini, Orion SSAG, IDAS LPS D-1, Optolong L-Enhance, ZWO UV/IR Cut, N.I.N.A., Green Swamp Server, PHD2, Adobe Photoshop CC, Pixinsight.
Dog and best bud: Jack
Sky: Bortle 6-7
My Astrobin: https://www.astrobin.com/users/Juno16/
User avatar
Larry 1969 United States of America
Milky Way Ambassador
Articles: 0
Offline
Posts: 1481
Joined: Fri May 17, 2019 12:33 am
4
Location: Pittsburgh PA USA
Status:
Offline

TSS Photo of the Day

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#12

Post by Larry 1969 »


I prefer the subtle version. The Cygnus Loop is supposed to be a super nova remnant with wispy filamentary detail and your "subtle" version captures that nicely. The "steroid" version, IMO, starts to make the wispy gasses look too solid... Just my personal opinion... Great images!

Larry
For visual:
10" Skywatcher collapsible goto dob, various EP's and a Celestron StarSense auto align.

For imaging:
Orion 8" astrograph 800mm @ F3.9
Eq6-R Pro controlled by APT via EQmod with an OTA mounted mini PC
Tele Vue Paracorr Type 2 coma corrector
Altair Hypercam 26C
Image
User avatar
notFritzArgelander
In Memory
In Memory
Articles: 0
Offline
Posts: 14925
Joined: Fri May 10, 2019 4:13 pm
4
Location: Idaho US
Status:
Offline

TSS Awards Badges

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#13

Post by notFritzArgelander »


Aw, heck. I usually dislike the "steroids" approach but in this case I'm totally persuaded! Where do you get your steroids and how do you keep the IOC off your back? ;)
Scopes: Refs: Orion ST80, SV 80EDA f7, TS 102ED f11 Newts: AWB 130mm, f5, Z12 f5; Cats: VMC110L, Intes MK66,VMC200L f9.75 EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker IV, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5
User avatar
Juno16 United States of America
Universal Ambassador
Articles: 0
Offline
Posts: 8195
Joined: Sun May 12, 2019 3:13 pm
4
Location: Mississippi Gulf Coast
Status:
Offline

TSS Awards Badges

TSS Photo of the Day

Re: Pickering’s Triangle Reprocess

#14

Post by Juno16 »


Larry 1969 wrote: Sat Sep 25, 2021 3:36 am I prefer the subtle version. The Cygnus Loop is supposed to be a super nova remnant with wispy filamentary detail and your "subtle" version captures that nicely. The "steroid" version, IMO, starts to make the wispy gasses look too solid... Just my personal opinion... Great images!

Larry
Hi Larry!

Thanks! That is exactly why I spent the effort reprocessing the image!

Call me boring, but even though I do like the extra zap of the steriod version, I also do appreciate the soft, more natural (to me) look. I would love to go into space and take a look around! Seriously!

My experience with printing says that the steriod version would be the way to go. It seems that by experience has been that the printed copy looses a lot of zap and the "steroid" version should print a slightly milder look.

Thanks for your comments Larry. They are much appreciated!

notFritzArgelander wrote: Sat Sep 25, 2021 5:51 am Aw, heck. I usually dislike the "steroids" approach but in this case I'm totally persuaded! Where do you get your steroids and how do you keep the IOC off your back? ;)

Quite simple nFA! The IOC doesn't give a hoot about astrophotography!

They would have their hands full! No, really, I always look up images in Google Images and the span of artistic expression for any one target is so broad the the IOC would have to 10X the staff!

Thanks for commenting nFA! Much appreciated!
Jim

Scopes: Explore Scientific ED102 APO, Sharpstar 61 EDPH II APO, Samyang 135 F2 (still on the Nikon).
Mount: Skywatcher HEQ5 Pro with Rowan Belt Mod
Stuff: ASI EAF Focus Motor (x2), Orion 50mm Guide Scope, ZWO 30 mm Guide Scope, ASI 220mm min, ASI 120mm mini, Stellarview 0.8 FR/FF, Sharpstar 0.8 FR/FF, Mele Overloock 3C.
Camera/Filters/Software: ASI 533 mc pro, ASI 120mm mini, Orion SSAG, IDAS LPS D-1, Optolong L-Enhance, ZWO UV/IR Cut, N.I.N.A., Green Swamp Server, PHD2, Adobe Photoshop CC, Pixinsight.
Dog and best bud: Jack
Sky: Bortle 6-7
My Astrobin: https://www.astrobin.com/users/Juno16/
Post Reply

Create an account or sign in to join the discussion

You need to be a member in order to post a reply

Create an account

Not a member? register to join our community
Members can start their own topics & subscribe to topics
It’s free and only takes a minute

Register

Sign in

Return to “Deep Sky Images”