Beginner with 4 choices, pls help

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mmrmm
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Re: Beginner with 4 choices, pls help

#81

Post by mmrmm » Sat Nov 30, 2019 12:50 am

Thank you all for the help so far!

If I go with an EQ mount I would go for this one:
https://www.astroshop.pt/telescopios/br ... ca/p,54274

Now that I understand that perhaps the Dobson mount could be interesting for me, I could pick this one up for the same price:
https://www.astroshop.pt/telescopios/om ... r_1_select

The Dobson seems like a good opportunity even more with the Black Friday discount, but I do not know if OMEGON is a good brand...

As I am completely new to this I would ask your supporting in this decision.
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#82

Post by notFritzArgelander » Sat Nov 30, 2019 1:45 am

Oregon doesn’t make their own scopes. It looks to me like they have this dob made by Synta. Orion and Celestron also have their dobs outsourced to Synta and GSO. Both manufacturers make good dobs.

One additional thought is that if you get the dob now, you could migrate to an EQ mount later on. You’d need a larger EQ than the EQ3 though.
Scopes: Refractors: Orion ST80, SV ED80 A f7; Newtonians: Z12 f5; Catadioptrics: VMC110L, Intes MK66. EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker III, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5, Orion Sirius EQG
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#83

Post by stewe » Sat Nov 30, 2019 10:18 am

As far as I know, none of the brands that came up so far in this thread manufacture telescopes themselves. The optics of these brands come from various Chinese and Taiwanese companies. You should not be concerned about the latter fact, as these companies produce generally very good-quality optics. The various brands just assemble and sale these optics.
Omegon is a German brand, you can think of it as the Astroshop chain's "own brand", you can find some info about them here:
https://www.nimax.de/company/foundation/
The optics in Omegon scopes are probably the same as in Celestron, Skywatcher, Bresser, etc. scopes. Omegon scopes are probably cheaper in the EU than the former because they are assembled in Europe and not in the US.
Clear skies!
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----------
telescope: Celestron C9.25
mount: Celestron AVX
binoculars: Lacerta 8x42 ED
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#84

Post by mmrmm » Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:31 pm

I believe I will go with this one indeed.
https://www.astroshop.pt/telescopios/om ... r_1_select

With all the support from Lady Fraktor and some other useful contribution I understood I need an alignment / collimation eyepiece. Is that still true for this telescope above? Would this one be ok?
https://www.astroshop.pt/ponteiro-a-las ... cao/p,4577

It comes with a plossl 25mm, should I include a 17mm as well?
https://www.astroshop.pt/oculares/omego ... 25-/p,4386

As you may realize I want to take advantage of the black weekend, so if there is anything that makes sense on this link pls help me to identify.
https://www.astroshop.pt/oculares/15_10 ... verkauf=Ja
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#85

Post by SkyHiker » Sat Nov 30, 2019 4:17 pm

Good choice! Instead of a 17 mm I would get a 9 mm and perhaps a Barlow. I recommend a laser collimator. In addition to what was said before, a laser collimator lets you sit behind the scope when adjusting the primary with no need to go back and forth to the eyepiece. That makes it a whole lot easier.
... Henk. :D Telescopes: 6" Mak-Newt (Comet Hunter), ES ED127CF, ES ED80, Zhumell Z12, Coulter Odyssey 10, AT6RC, Venture RX-7, Celestron Skymaster 20x80, Mounts and tripod: Losmandy G11S, AVX, LXD55, Tiltall, Cameras: Fuji X-a1, Canon SX40, Xt, XSi, T6, ELPH 100HS, DIY: Dob and camera barndoor trackers, afocal adapter, Dob with foldable base and Az/Alt setting circles, Accessories: SSAG, Plossls, Barlows, Telrad, laser collimators (Seben LK1, Z12, Howie Glatter), Cheshire, 2 Orion RACIs 8x50, Software: DSS, ImageMagick, PHD, Nebulosity, Photo Gallery, Gimp, CHDK
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#86

Post by mmrmm » Sat Nov 30, 2019 4:27 pm

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#87

Post by mmrmm » Sat Nov 30, 2019 4:27 pm

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#88

Post by notFritzArgelander » Sat Nov 30, 2019 4:55 pm

Nice choice overall. DSOs like globular clusters need 200mm aperture to show well.

Eyepiece kits are usually not as good as spending a little more on individually selected eyepieces. Your selection is an f6 scope so I would aim at 30mm and 12mm eyepieces as a first upgrade.
Scopes: Refractors: Orion ST80, SV ED80 A f7; Newtonians: Z12 f5; Catadioptrics: VMC110L, Intes MK66. EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker III, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5, Orion Sirius EQG
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#89

Post by mmrmm » Sat Nov 30, 2019 4:57 pm

And should I aim to “fixed” apertures or these later ones (8-21 mm) I shared are also ok?
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#90

Post by notFritzArgelander » Sat Nov 30, 2019 5:02 pm

mmrmm wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 4:57 pm
And should I aim to “fixed” apertures or these later ones (8-21 mm) I shared are also ok?
Unless you spend a lot on a zoom they degrade the image at least a little.

https://www.astroshop.pt/oculares/baade ... ce/p,53114

Is a good one. They are mostly useful for finding the optimum exit pupil and magnification for an object. I then switch to a fixed focus eyepiece for the clearest view. The Vixen zoom is also good. Others have not pleased.

https://www.astroshop.pt/oculares/vixen ... 25-/p,5881
Scopes: Refractors: Orion ST80, SV ED80 A f7; Newtonians: Z12 f5; Catadioptrics: VMC110L, Intes MK66. EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker III, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5, Orion Sirius EQG
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#91

Post by mmrmm » Sat Nov 30, 2019 5:16 pm

That is what I though. The telescope comes with a 25mm, so I am considering the following two add-ons:
https://www.astroshop.pt/oculares/omego ... ce/p,47415
https://www.astroshop.pt/lentes-barlow/ ... r_0_select

Perhaps this way I cover a good range for a beginner. Hopefully. :)
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#92

Post by mmrmm » Sat Nov 30, 2019 5:22 pm

If I understand the math correctly I would therefore have the following magnification options:

10mm Barlow 240x
10mm 120x
25mm Barlow 96x
25mm 48x

Is this a good span, and is it within the telescope “capacity”?
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#93

Post by notFritzArgelander » Sat Nov 30, 2019 5:29 pm

mmrmm wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 5:16 pm
That is what I though. The telescope comes with a 25mm, so I am considering the following two add-ons:
https://www.astroshop.pt/oculares/omego ... ce/p,47415
https://www.astroshop.pt/lentes-barlow/ ... r_0_select

Perhaps this way I cover a good range for a beginner. Hopefully. :)
Fine ideas these would be. Upgrading to a set that includes a 30mm and 12mm can wait until you get some experience using what you've selected. Whether you want to do that depends on your aims as an observer.

1) If you are happy just seeing objects you might be happy for a lifetime with your choices.
2) If you become an ambitious observer and want to improve your skills as an observer, you may want to upgrade to eyepieces that are excellent rather than good.

Much of the seeming disagreement in advice you are getting is based on implicit differences in the observing goals.
Scopes: Refractors: Orion ST80, SV ED80 A f7; Newtonians: Z12 f5; Catadioptrics: VMC110L, Intes MK66. EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker III, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5, Orion Sirius EQG
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#94

Post by notFritzArgelander » Sat Nov 30, 2019 5:45 pm

mmrmm wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 5:22 pm
If I understand the math correctly I would therefore have the following magnification options:

10mm Barlow 240x
10mm 120x
25mm Barlow 96x
25mm 48x

Is this a good span, and is it within the telescope “capacity”?
Yes, it's well within capacity. The barlowed 25mm will give the maximum resolution exit pupil of 2mm. The 10mm with and without Barlow will give good higher magnifications. (1.7mm and ~0.8mm.) At lower than 0.5mm exit pupil you will start seeing the defects in your own eye so 400x is the maximum. That might be unreachable because of the atmospheric turbulence no more than a few times a year.

At som point a lower magnification eyepiece should be a long term goal. If you are an elder person 36mm would be fine. If you are young a 42mm would be good until you aged a bit.
Scopes: Refractors: Orion ST80, SV ED80 A f7; Newtonians: Z12 f5; Catadioptrics: VMC110L, Intes MK66. EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker III, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5, Orion Sirius EQG
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#95

Post by mmrmm » Sat Nov 30, 2019 6:11 pm

Order almost done. :)

Question, would the telescope
https://www.astroshop.pt/telescopios/om ... 00/p,53802

Fit into this transportation bag?
https://www.astroshop.pt/bolsas-de-tran ... 8-/p,49629

I cannot find measures of the telescope. The bag mentions telescopes which I assume are the same size as the one I want, but it is not explicitly mentioned...
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#96

Post by Lady Fraktor » Sat Nov 30, 2019 6:18 pm

To be sure you get the right one send an e-mail and ask.
If you are planning on traveling with the telescope a bag can be useful.
If just for storage or at home use I would not bother.
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#97

Post by notFritzArgelander » Sat Nov 30, 2019 6:21 pm

Lady Fraktor wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 6:18 pm
To be sure you get the right one send an e-mail and ask.
If you are planning on traveling with the telescope a bag can be useful.
If just for storage or at home use I would not bother.
That's best, ask. Most 200mm f6 OTAs are ~115cm long. The bag is 120cm. To be sure get an answer from the seller.
Scopes: Refractors: Orion ST80, SV ED80 A f7; Newtonians: Z12 f5; Catadioptrics: VMC110L, Intes MK66. EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker III, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5, Orion Sirius EQG
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#98

Post by mmrmm » Sat Nov 30, 2019 6:41 pm

Agree. Problem is that this is a special promo and I am afraid to lose it...

Really annoying that there is no indication of the telescope length.
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#99

Post by mmrmm » Sat Nov 30, 2019 6:46 pm

Found it!

115cms indeed! :)

Thanks for all the support!
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#100

Post by mmrmm » Sat Nov 30, 2019 6:49 pm

Lady Fraktor wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 8:54 pm
The motors should be identical as they are both for a EQ-3??

The book Turn Left At Orion is a good one to start out with.
Almost forgot this book suggestion from Lady Fraktor - just added to the order. :)
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