trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

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mcolbert
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trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#1

Post by mcolbert »


one of the DIY projects on the go at the moment is causing some fun and games. :). I have some ex military optics from various sources and one is for testing alignments I believe. Anyway, this has a nice 50mm lens which I thought could be adapted for a guidescope or as a separate solar telescope etc. Now, to my mind, the first thing is to remove the lens from the very heavy steel tube. Easier said than done! Looking at the front of the tube there are two rings to remove before I get to the lens. Hmmm, how to remove them? I get some good advice about a spanner wrench, the one I purchased from E.S. is fine for small lenses, but it doesn't have a snowflake's chance in moving these rings. (at this point several weeks have gone by since the original idea struck.). So now I move to WD40 in an attempt to loosen the rings.... nope, not a fraction of movement. Time to ask for more assistance, received more good advice; acetone (tried that last night, checked this morning...nope - will try again several times today but not hopeful), then on to the transmission fluid - if I can find it in the boot - (yes, I know, look under the bonnet!) if nothing spare then I'll have my wife pick up some on the way home from work. If that doesn't work, there are a couple of other things to try - but running out of options here.... anyone have an oxy acetylene kit? :). Or maybe it's time to get the chainsaw out? :0


As they say, watch this space :)
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#2

Post by notFritzArgelander »


Have you considered a shaped charge explosive? ;)
Scopes: Refs: Orion ST80, SV 80EDA f7, TS 102ED f11 Newts: AWB 130mm, f5, Z12 f5; Cats: VMC110L, Intes MK66,VMC200L f9.75 EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker IV, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#3

Post by mcolbert »


notFritzArgelander wrote: Mon May 27, 2019 9:38 pm Have you considered a shaped charge explosive? ;)
I'm not at point yet, but given that it is ex military, I wouldn't be surprised if that turns out to be the solution. ;)
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#4

Post by Lady Fraktor »


If there is a camera shop in your area that does repairs ask if they will loosen the rings for you, they should have the proper HD spanner tools.
See Far Sticks: Antares Elita 103/1575, AOM FLT 105/1000, Bresser BV 127/1200, Nočný stopár 152/1200, Vyrobené doma 70/700, Stellarvue NHNG DX 80/552, TAL RS100/1000, Vixen SD115s/885
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#5

Post by mcolbert »


thanks for the suggestion, sadly though we are in a rural setting (village of 1300, about 80 kms from the nearest large town 60,000) and the last photo shop closed about three years ago.:(. Even then it was primarily retail. :). Hence DIY is the order of the day. :)
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#6

Post by Lady Fraktor »


Put the optics in a freezer and then heat the outside shell with a dryer?
If you have a helper handy you can work out who holds while the other turns the rings :)
See Far Sticks: Antares Elita 103/1575, AOM FLT 105/1000, Bresser BV 127/1200, Nočný stopár 152/1200, Vyrobené doma 70/700, Stellarvue NHNG DX 80/552, TAL RS100/1000, Vixen SD115s/885
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Az/Alt: AYO Digi II/ Argo Navis, Stellarvue M2C/ Argo Navis
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#7

Post by chicagorandy »


IF there are slots cut into the rings for a spanner, perhaps cut a length of metal rod or sheet to fit into those slots across the rings so you can then turn them with a pair of pliers? Trying to visualize the issue. A pic might help.
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#8

Post by Lokifish »


I used to repair cameras and lenses, and the suggestion of hot/cold cycles to break it loose is a good idea. I also suggest a little silicone oil in the treads as it will wick during these cycles and help lube the treads. Whatever you do, don't use WD-40, or similar, as that has some nasty off gassing that can damage optical coatings.
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#9

Post by mcolbert »


firstly, thanks to everyone for suggestions - they are appreciated immensely. ;)

Lady Fractor, the freezing idea sounds like a goer, I have already been advised to apply heat and the Dremel is ready for that. I t wasn't suggested though to freeze first.
BTW I am my own helper. ;)
Chicagorandy, I have already been advised to use a spanner wrench and I purchased one from Edmund but that isn't strong enough. I then did as you suggested and had a local engineer cut up two pieces of steel to fit. I have been using those in an effort to move the rings, still no luck. (poor) Images of the problem at on IMGUR

Lokifish, many thanks for letting me know about this. I shall refrain from further use of WD40. Others have recommended a combination with various other substances, but nothing yet.

I raised this as a problem several weeks ago on another forum and so far have received many suggestions including;
1. turning the rings clockwise and then anti-clockwise, in an effort to break the grip. That is SOP for me, if it doesn't work one way, maybe the other?? :)
2. automatic transmission fluid, which I have and will try today.
3. Superlube and Safety Wash combined - I've yet to source these locally or on the net
4. acetone - again applying that to the rings hasn't done anything
5. applying heat as per ladyfractor above
6. cutting the rings (which will be a challenge - to say the least! :). )
7. brute force on the rings - that's an encouraging one. ;)

So I am at the stage of transmission fluid, Superlube and Safety Wash and Freeze / Heat with the Dremel. I have an interesting day ahead. :)

One factor that may be important is that as this is ex-military, then in the image one can see the remnants of an orange sealant (which I have scraped most off) which may only have military applications. Consequently, I may have to chase up the Bundeswehr engineer corps. ;(. If not for the fact that this is a Zeiss lens, I wouldn't bother. But it does make me VERY careful. ;)

Thanks everyone!
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#10

Post by Lady Fraktor »


A 50/50 mix of transmission fluid and methyl hydrate makes a good penetrating oil though I would be a bit iffy on having transmission fluid around the lens coatings.
Suggestion #1 sometimes works if the materials are galled together which is likely what has happened if made of aluminium. Corrosion does wonderful things.
If there is some type of locktite in there the freezing/ heating may help break it loose.
See Far Sticks: Antares Elita 103/1575, AOM FLT 105/1000, Bresser BV 127/1200, Nočný stopár 152/1200, Vyrobené doma 70/700, Stellarvue NHNG DX 80/552, TAL RS100/1000, Vixen SD115s/885
EQ: TAL MT-1, Vixen SXP, AXJ, AXD
Az/Alt: AYO Digi II/ Argo Navis, Stellarvue M2C/ Argo Navis
Tripods: Berlebach Planet (2), Uni 28 Astro, Report 372, TAL factory maple, Vixen ASG-CB90, Vixen AXD-TR102
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#11

Post by smeyer8015 »


How thick is this steel tube? Can it be cut with a Dremel tool?
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#12

Post by mcolbert »


Lady Fractor thanks, it does seem that the freezing/heating is the next step. There has been no movement at all with the transmission fluid, so I will try the methyl hydrate with the fluid as a last effort prior to the freezer. ;)
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#13

Post by mcolbert »


smeyer8015, short answer; 5mm and nope! :). I tried to open an album to place another image of the instrument but that will have to be later on. When I can post to an album I will add a few more images that will make it easier to see what I am dealing with. ;). Thabnks.
Refractor - APQ 130 Reflector - Meade SCT Au coating. Mount - AYOMaster (on order)
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#14

Post by Lokifish »


Any locktite or thread epoxy will take multiple goes with a heat gun. Unlike locktite though, thread epoxy (typically orange or yellow in color) is fairly resistant to solvents. You can literally soak threads that have been sealed with this stuff in Goof-Off, and it still won't release.

I'll keep an eye out on this thread for pics.
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#15

Post by mcolbert »


Lokifish thanks for the info. I was beginning to wonder why, with all of the applications of different substances that there wasn't at least some small movement. Going by the orange colour, it would be a thread epoxy that has been used.

The images so far (poor ones at that!) are at

I am still waiting to see how I can create an album on this site. ;)

I'm glad I've got plenty of gas refills for the Dremel then.;). It does seem that this will be a long ongoing project.

Maybe I should now start another thread regarding the next task - removal of the primary from the Meade.;)

Thanks! ;)
Refractor - APQ 130 Reflector - Meade SCT Au coating. Mount - AYOMaster (on order)
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#16

Post by mcolbert »


well, thanks to all the input I must report a partial success using the heating method via. a gas powered Dremel. I have managed to unscrew the lower ring a few mm and am now taking it easy in unscrewing it the rest of the way. The top ring is still stubbornly in place so we'll see how I can remove the lens without damaging it. Once that's done, I'll move on to phase two, as it were and post accordingly. ;)
Refractor - APQ 130 Reflector - Meade SCT Au coating. Mount - AYOMaster (on order)
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#17

Post by Lady Fraktor »


Good luck, sometimes they can be a real ______!
See Far Sticks: Antares Elita 103/1575, AOM FLT 105/1000, Bresser BV 127/1200, Nočný stopár 152/1200, Vyrobené doma 70/700, Stellarvue NHNG DX 80/552, TAL RS100/1000, Vixen SD115s/885
EQ: TAL MT-1, Vixen SXP, AXJ, AXD
Az/Alt: AYO Digi II/ Argo Navis, Stellarvue M2C/ Argo Navis
Tripods: Berlebach Planet (2), Uni 28 Astro, Report 372, TAL factory maple, Vixen ASG-CB90, Vixen AXD-TR102
Diagonals: Astro-Physics, Baader Amici, Baader Herschel, iStar Blue, Stellarvue DX, Takahashi prism, TAL, Vixen flip mirror
Eyepieces: Antares to Zeiss
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Re: trying to retrieve a 50mm lens

#18

Post by notFritzArgelander »


Excellent to hear of progress. :)
Scopes: Refs: Orion ST80, SV 80EDA f7, TS 102ED f11 Newts: AWB 130mm, f5, Z12 f5; Cats: VMC110L, Intes MK66,VMC200L f9.75 EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, Plossl 32-8mm. Mixed brand Masuyama/Astroplans Binoculars: Nikon Aculon 10x50, Celestron 15x70, Baader Maxbright. Mounts: Star Seeker IV, Vixen Porta II, Celestron CG5
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